(11-1-18) Morning - 391.5 Theodore & Jeff - (hV2GKur7DjU)

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Publish Date: 11/1/2018
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Language: English
Channel Group: ASOTP
YouTube Title: (11-1-18) Morning - 391.5 Theodore & Jeff-hV2GKur7DjU
YouTube ID: hV2GKur7DjU

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you let's pray and then well good morning so we have been trying to make a complicated topic simple and I don't know how successful we've been but we believe that people have a better understanding after Philip and Anne Tanisha have presented their understanding and we've worked through some of the the math a little bit in some of the complexities of these lines and these lines as we know they're all based upon a structure that we recognized in the kings of Judah and in Ezekiel's prophecy and also specifically Revelation chapter 9 verse 15 the structure of the first and the second woe and this this number three hundred ninety one point five days we now understand this to be a prophetic symbol and that it points to November ninth 2019 but it also points to if you look on the bottom one not the bottom one but the one in blue it says July 18 2020 now these are all Julian dates these blue dates here on on my right side your left and July 18th is actually on the Gregorian July 20 July 31st that's because for all these blue dates you would add thirteen days to get our calendar because at the present time the Julian and the Gregorian calendar are 13 days apart and I know that these things can be rather complex trying to look at all these different calendars and understand them so I'm going to go through Ezekiel's literal prophecy and try to understand some of the the logic in a bit simpler way of how we we're using these dates and I you have a piece of paper that has some dates and something came up near the end of the last meeting regarding Miller's apology and defense and the date that it was published and we're gonna look at that as well but first I'd like to look at Ezekiel so Ezekiel chapter 1 verse 1 and 2 does anybody know what date it tells us that he had his first vision the fifth day of the fourth month so we're gonna go 5th day fourth month and this is in the year 592 BC and it's also July 21st now this this paper that you have this is from the 360 day calendar converter I like it just because I can put all the dates together it has some anomalies in it some of the calendar converters when you convert the time of day this one actually changes the day for the Jewish date in the morning so that has the Jewish day starting in the morning so that sometimes creates confusion when you're looking at Jewish States when you start using decimal places instead of having it start the evening before it changes the date in the morning so we all know the day starts in the evening so the Jewish date can sometimes be off by day just because of the calendar converter so I don't want you to get confused about that but when we look at some of these dates I'll point that out when when that happens and if you were to use this calendar converter and you were to look up the fifth day of the fourth month in 592 BC and the thing that this program does is it uses a minus sign for BC dates which I don't like but that's some programs use the BC ad and you click on that this one just for mathematical convenience it uses the - but if you looked up the 5th day of the fourth month you wouldn't get July 21st 592 BC because this is the rabbinic calendar it's not the biblical calendar but it still works for producing dates so we understand that both the rabbinic and the biblical so the rabbinic is just a calendar that was invented 400 AD so it was long after the time of Christ it wasn't in use in the time when Jesus was alive and the biblical calendar is something that's deduced deduced from Scripture by looking at all the different dates and finding no contradictions when you compare different dates and also it has brought a whole bunch of things to light that we wouldn't have noticed if we were just using the rabbinic calendar so this date here July 21st 592 BC there are some Adventist scholars who use this date for Ezekiel's first vision because they're using the correct calendar they know how to produce the calendar correctly and Ezekiel has this vision in chapter 2 if you go to chapter 2 of his ikan which I don't want you to do right now but if you go there you'll find that he has this vision or in his vision because this is a vision that he has in his vision he gets carried away to Tel Aviv in Babylon and he sits with the elders there for seven days now that doesn't actually happen it's just something that happens in vision and so some people when they get to Ezekiel 4 they think that it's 7 days later but it's not because if you read it carefully you realize it's just something that happens in vision and nobody's going to sit there for 7 days silent in front of the elders it's just not gonna happen there'd be a lot of conversations going on if he was magically transported over to Tel Aviv so when he sits or lies on his left side in Ezekiel 4 verse 4 to 6 it gives us this prophecy and it says that he lies on his left side for 390 days and this is given as a day for a year prophecy and we're not going to look at the prophecy of Ezekiel but just this literal line down on his left side if you count 390 days you'll find that he wakes up on the morning of his 300 after completing 390 days he would wake up on the tenth day of the fifth month well more specifically if you just counted 390 days from July 21st you would come to the date and I'm just gonna make sure I did this right do this right is there's a lot of dates in my head yes that's what I thought so you're gonna come up to the date August 15th 591 BC so what's the significance of August 15th it's the midnight cry so the very fact that we can do this that we can start at midnight count three hundred ninety days on any calendar that goes from July 21st if you count two from July 21st you'll get the next year August 15th doesn't matter Julian Gregorian you will always produce that date okay so this is extremely powerful just in that symbol alone without looking at any other calendars we can see that this is extremely powerful in demonstrating from midnight to the midnight cry right so some of these things are very simple that we can all understand we don't we don't have to know a lot about different calendars now we also find though that this date is the tenth day the fifth month so that's according to the biblical calendar so this I have to calculate again using this and using this because if this isn't the the biblical this isn't the rabbinic date and neither is this the rabbinic date will yield something different so if you go on a calendar converter and you look up July 21st 592 it's going to give you the fifth month and I think the sixth day and it would do something like that to it give you the six months in the eleventh day or something it's a month in a day off okay does that make sense that you have these rabbinic dates that we're not using here I'm just using the biblical dates on the bottom but this tenth day the fifth month we know is the day that Jerusalem was destroyed in 586 and also in 70 AD now the Jews celebrate the ninth of ah've or the ninth day of the fifth month in commemoration of this event and that's because it's on the night before that the fires begin that that this attack an assault on the temple occurs both in 586 and in 70 AD and so they don't celebrate the day that the temple actually was finally destroyed they celebrate the day of the attack against the temple so some people you know get confused about that but it's clear in the Bible and in Josephus that it's the 10th day of the fifth month that both temples were destroyed we then turned to Ezekiel chapter 20 and we found that this date the biblical date the 10th day the 5th month is once again mentioned so in Ezekiel 20 we now have this this as a symbol the 10th day of the fifth month becomes a symbol of the destruction of the of the temple and what is the temple if we're going to use the temple as a symbol it symbolizes the church right so when you get to Ezekiel 20 and it talks about it came to pass in the seventh year in the fifth month and the tenth day of the month that certain of the elders of Israel came to inquire of the Lord and sat before me you'll find in some Bibles it will say that this is the second time that he sits with the elders and that's because they take chapter 2 where it talks about this where he's carried to Tel Aviv as the first time he meets with the elders but this is actually the first time yes elder Jeff actually chapter 3 chapter 3 yes that's astonish for seven days okay you're right chapter three two markets what I'm saying but I don't think your logic you can said it's very sound in showing that it's carried to Tel Aviv and he sits there among them for seven day it's not seven days astonished and your logic is is that no one would really set there for seven days without speaking yeah but I would argue well no one would really actually late on their size without moving for three hundred and ninety days and then flip to the other side and stay there for forty days but he doesn't lie on his side for three hundred ninety days without moving he just sleeps on his left side every night it's just a night yeah yeah and and you're right it's chapter three nothing to destroy your logic because I know if the other side the issue we're accurate it would add seven days into your formula we don't want to deal with that but I think there's a better there probably is a better argument then what I'm here but I could be wrong yeah are you sure chapter three is it in Chapter three oh yeah you're right it's 3:00 3:15 yeah then I came yeah so the spirit lifted me up and took me away and I went in bitterness in the heat of my spirit by the hand but that but the hand of Lord was strong upon me and then I came to them of the captivity of Tel Aviv and dwelt by the river key bar and I sat where they sat and remained there astonished among them seven days and it came to pass at the end of seven days that the word of Lord came unto me saying right so the argument would be and I've seen both in commentaries some will argue that this is just in vision and that this is in reality but the argument that's made is that every vision begins with a date and that he's marking a particular vision so when you read Ezekiel and it's it's hard to discern but if you look at revelation the book of Revelation when did John receive his vision he received his vision on the Sabbath and the whole book of is given to him in one day and there's all kinds of things that happened to him but it's all one vision in Ezekiel when he gives the different dates these refer to all one vision and so this is the way that I've taken it some people might try to argue they might try to argue that I'm seven days off now in this but it produces these these dates and if you add the seven days into the mix it creates a problem but you know so that's something that somebody might argue against but but it's a good point to bring up so if we have this here and he's lying here and he ends up waking up on the tenth day the fifth month we find that in Ezekiel 20 there's a vision that's on the tenth day of the fifth month so this would be 590 BC now if we already use the biblical calendar we would find that this is August 18th I believe it could be wrong I keep getting this one mixed up no it's August 2nd that's right it's the next one that's August 18th so this is August 2nd biblical calendar that's the date there's Ana Julian date as well it would be about a month different or about not a month different 13 days I can't remember how many days apart it is but it doesn't probably matter here at this point oh yes this one does matter because if I was to use I need to make sure I'm doing this right again so August 2nd yes if I use the Gregorian calendar this is July 27th so maybe I should be consistent I'm going to do it I'll do it in a different color anyway even though it's not the same color code as he has there but this is July 27th different color than purple okay this is Gregorian so these are Julian dates when you deal with these BC years that's not a good color this is July 27th on the Gregorian calendar so it's the same year this is the same point of time so August 2nd on the Julian is July 27th on the Gregorian and I can even put a G after it okay so we get this symbol produced as well so we now have one of the symbols from Josiah Lich's prophecy the 391 Year prophecy now the next thing that we know is that Jerusalem is destroyed on in 586 now you have a diagram and I'm not sure yeah so I should have pointed you to this if you look on your page there's there's four different dates and if you look at the one that says Ezekiel 20 I want you to look at that it's the third one from the top and I'm using the calendar converter and you can see that it says Gregorian date - 589 and if you look at the bottom of that one it says Julian date 590 so they got minuses instead of BC and you can see that they're one year different and that's just because the Gregorian date in this program uses a zero year but the Julian date doesn't but I want you to look at the date here and you'll see that there's there's a difference it says August 1st and July 26th so what you find is in this year the biblical date is one day different than the Hebrew date this is the Hebrew modern rabbinic calendar and sometimes it's a month off sometimes it's a day off sometimes it's a month in a day in this case it happens to be one day different than the biblical calendar right so in this year if you looked up the rabbinic date it's going to give you August 1st and July 26th does that make sense but this is the correct date based upon how to count the days on the rabbinic calendar does anybody have questions about that that make sense to people that yes no okay so the biblical calendar is based on a observance of the moon the rabbinic calendar is a calculated calendar that was created in for the 4th century AD and it can be off because it's not based upon observance of the moon it's just based upon a pattern a repeated pattern of a met call the metonic cycle that every 19 years the calendar repeats and it's close but it can be off mostly it's off just by a day a quarter of the time it will be the same so 25% of the time the rabbinic calendar and the biblical calendar will give you the same dates yes well when Jesus was crucified in 31 ad if we were using the rabbinic calendar we could not have Jesus crucified on a Friday in 31 ad and that's actually where this all started from this started from Adventism created this date October 22nd 1844 misunderstanding the calendars but they got the correct date and when they started to look at this afterwards we started to realize that there was problems if we were just to use the rabbinic calendar so the Millerites had used mistakenly the biblical calendar they thought they're using the Karaite calendar but they weren't but they they use the biblical calendar and that we could go back and look at 31 ad and realize that if we're going to get have Jesus crucified he has to be crucified on a Friday in 31 ad and the only way that you could do that is the biblical calendar and that's ascertained by basically working backwards and grace ammidon an Adventist scholar in the 30s and 40s she wrote extensively on this she was made fun of by the scholarly world even though she published in scholarly magazines if you read people's articles regarding her work they made fun of her won because she was a woman and too because she was a Seventh day Adventist so her work wasn't actually accepted even though it was published in peer-reviewed journals and even with in Adventism her work was buried and it was buried by people like Froome and Conrad II people like that were not interested in her work being understood so most Adventists don't even know who grace ammidon is so it's not Conrad II what's the guy's no Cattrall that's the name I'm think you know I knew it started with this II Cattrall yeah so Cattrall and other people really have buried her work so it's even hard to find but you can find it on the Internet but it's not celebrated with in Adventism so the Jerusalem was destroyed if you look at that bottom one you'll see that this is again the rabbinic date and the date that it's it gives for the tenth day of the fifth month so I've is the fifth month it will say it's July 18th on the Julian date so and this is July 18th and this is 586 BC now I don't want people to get confused about it but this is just the rabbinic date so the redic date produces this if you use the biblical day to give you aa ggest 18th but what I did is I looked at each of the dates and when I saw the date July 18th I then did this I went July 18th five but twenty twenty so there's this skip this step I took which some people think is just sort of a leap I thought of it as a step but it's a leap and I said well this is interesting because this is the date of Samuel snows letters the last of his letters the last of that chiasm that starts in February 16th so as we went through last night July 18th 1844 it's the publication of Samuel snows last letter but it wasn't just that when I looked at this date I found that it was the tenth day of the fifth month in 2020 which I didn't put on here but if you look up the tenth day the fifth month it'll give you July 18th on the Julian calendar right now this is actually July 31st but it's also the tenth day of the fifth month and so that's actually really what I was looking at I wanted to look at the tenth day of the fifth month in 2020 and when I looked at the tenth day the fifth month I found it produced the same date July 18th that it produced in 586 on the Julian calendar so I had a double coincidence or a double hit if I looked up the date July 18th in 2020 I would get the tenth day of the fifth month so I wasn't just putting July 18th there I was putting two different dates that happened in 586 I was putting both of those dates on the same spot in 2020 and so to me that was a coincidence that I I couldn't ignore and then as you know we then counted 391 days back from that and we came to the date June 22nd and again this date was a Julian date so I probably should have put the Julian dates in blue to keep them consistent with that but I got it reversed so hopefully that doesn't confuse you and that was why was this important that I found June 22nd it's Samuel snows third letter right so the fact that I could just do this I could count back from July 18th to June 22nd and get that date was very significant and as you saw we then built all the way back and all of Samuel snows letters lay in this pattern that we found in the vision of 20 2016 or 2019 so when we had this pattern November 9th 2019 the 391 point five days the 120 days in the 126 days we found that this matched Samuel snows letters so we have again we have the 391 days now here it's only 26 days you know if you just measured this here and I'm going to deal with that in a minute but all the Samuel snows letters were produced the dates and this was mind-blowing or interesting depend on which way you look at it but it seemed God's providence so God's design had this structure that we never noticed about Samuel snows letters and that that structure exists in the prophecy of Ezekiel in the reigns of the kings of Judah and in Samuel or Josiah Lich's prophecy so we got Ezekiel just Josiah which which is using the prophecy of Josiah as a starting point and the history of the kings of Judah so I want to look at is this making more sense to people this idea that this pattern exists and that all we're doing is we're looking for patterns does everybody understand this idea that we're looking for patterns and that these patterns exist and these patterns exist using dates and dates are symbols even if we don't understand all the mechanisms regarding this we at least can understand the principles behind it right so is there anybody who doesn't understand any of the principles behind it okay so we mechanism into principle that's a good question Philip what's the difference between a mechanism in a principle he can give us a good scientific explanation yes okay is that a good explanation I think so you use this word so I don't know what you meant by this well a principle is something you derive it's like a loss yes right Oh your support yeah mechanism means I'll just use one of them I just use principal yuji's principle but there's a mechanism so you find like if you have a machine that works in methodology it works on certain principles but it's a mechanism and I can use that mechanism like a clock I can use a clock to tell the time and it's based on certain mathematical principles do I need to understand all the principles to read the time on the clock no I don't so so there's the principle behind it but then there's actually how it's worked out in reality so we have these calendars that give us this mechanism all these different connections of dates that's rather complex and we may not understand all the details of that we may not understand how the clock works what we can tell the time right and so that's that's what God has given us with the with these these with the clock that he's given us no clock he's given us is the sky and it's very complex and when we we look at Ezekiel the wheels within a wheel I picture it as a clock I put picture there's all these cogs and gears working and when one turns the other turns but they're all different ratios we can talk about them as being fractals but that's actually kind of what you have in a clock in a mechanism you have fractals that actually occur within that machine we may not know how a clock works and clocks and watches can be very complex and they may look like they're in confusion but they're all in perfect order because if they weren't in perfect order what would the clock do yeah yeah it wouldn't tell time for one error wouldn't tell the correct time so everything has to be correct and that's how God has worked and we've had these line upon lines and all these different things and God has helped us understand and the principles of now we're starting to understand the principles of these things not just looking at the lines and memorizing them we're starting to understand more and more how God works and we can see his fingerprint so this this idea of this 391 point 5 shows up again and again now I just want to bring up one little detail and it and it might help us and it might not help us it's not super duper important but if you look at these first two charts I did something I took the date July 18th in 1844 so that's the date of Samuel snows letter now if you look at the Hebrew date there that's the rabbinic date and it doesn't say the second day of the fourth month it says the second day of the fifth month so the rabbinic date as we know in 1844 they started the year on march 21st with the year actually started on April 19th so you're going to have the rabbinical calendar be one month early compared to the biblical in 1844 correct yeah Havas the fifth month right we know that Samuel snows letter was written was published on the second day of the fourth month because it was three days before midnight at midnight is the fifth day of the fourth month right so if you looked at the biblical date for 1844 you're gonna be a month off just because they started the year one month before Adventist it before the Millerites did they're starting March 21st we're starting April 19th is the first day of the first month so in that year the biblical calendar differs one month from the rabbinic so I have that date there July 18th and what I did is I counted now here we counted in Samuel snows letters from June 22nd to July 18th 391 and a half days but if I count from July 18th three hundred ninety one point five days I will come to a different date right and that date that I come to July 18th if I count it I come and that's what this is a calculation it's counting three hundred ninety one point five days and it comes to August first on the Julian date now notice it's August 13th above but it's August 1st on the Julian date now you'll see there it says of 11 it's actually should be of 10 it should be the tenth day of the fifth month in the biblical calendar it's just that the rabbinic calendar is one day off in 1845 they're only one day off because we added the extra month and in the Jewish year 1844 when they get to the end there they add their extra month and so they catch up with us the next year so this is going to be July 18th 1844 and then I'm going to count over here and I'm going to come to the tenth day of the fifth month and that date is going to be August first but that's Julian nope this is a Gregorian so but I just want to see that I I get this date when I count that now I also find that I got this date if I started in June 22nd and I counted three hundred ninety one point five days in 1844 so if I start on June 22nd I'm gonna end up with July 18th and I wanted to make a point about this just about these symbols does anybody know when Miller's apology in the defense was published you love it either I told you that it was July 18th it was actually August 1st it was written on July 18th and so when we wouldn't and this is what I'm just talking about the wheels within the wheels I'm not asking you to memorize this you know this is not a point that you have to you know have nailed down but just the fact that I can take both June 22nd and July 18th and count three hundred ninety one point five days from that and I come to the date as a symbol of the writing of Miller's apology of defense and also the date that it's published is significant it just shows that this structure this complexity these wheels within wheels that God has given us produce again and again these symbols that that we're looking for and the fact that it gives us two of them many times it gets two hits sometimes three hits that are all connected somatically and the chances of that occurring are impossible without design yes what's that this is like a meeting beginning August 1st yeah in 1844 yeah yes the Concord camp meeting is August 1st as well so August 1st becomes a symbol just like the other ones do but the point about these symbols that I want people to really hone on in is that these symbols show up in the right place at the right time that we have lots of numbers now that are symbols but we don't just have we're not having November 9th showing up here we're having things that are connected with each other and we can now see that there's a connection between Samuel snows the publish ment of his last letter on July 18th and Miller's apology and defense that's written on July 18th and yet also that date of August 1st now becomes a symbol so so God is again and again using these symbols now how far you want to get in your understanding of them is up to you you don't need to understand all these things but you do need to understand enough to know the principles you need to be able to understand and trust the clock that it's giving you the correct time even if you don't know how a clock works you should know that it's working on certain principles and the fact that the clock gives you the correct time every day is evidence that you need to trust in the clock the fact that these numbers produce these results is the evidence that we need to know that the clock is working properly right because some people wonder well how do we just accept this on faith yes you do just like you accept the clock based upon faith okay I got elder Jeff and Daniel's and Philip okay a question and then a comment on the the last the June 22nd in the July what are those Julian Gregory another yeah so they're switching sometimes between so this is this is Gregorian and the August first date is Julian so well June 22nd this is just the same calendar whatever date you pick June 22nd to delight in --the is the same calendar it doesn't matter if this is a Gregorian this will be the Gregorian date produced if this is a Julie and this will be the Julian date produced those dates on any calendar are 391 days apart right okay the second thing is is that the the emphasis of those two dates that you produce with Miller writing his apology and it being published is an extension of the history of Samuel snows letters and it's already established that we're watching Samuel snows letters in the context of when he writes them and when they give published when he writes them when they get published so yes I did that those two elements are in Miller's apology down there in 1845 it connects it with the whole sentence exactly so we have this structure showing up again and again the same pattern writing and publishing now connected those two dates are connected okay Daniel you had a comment this is detached she placed Concorde as 2016 we're seeing Concord as a end of 391 and a half they really could calculate from 2016 end of ever 9 300 and then I don't know anyone from August 1st and try to find out where we show up alright okay yeah so what what you're asking us to do is to continue doing this are you over and over and over again and see what we produce well it's possible I'm not gonna do it right now but but thanks for the suggestion okay Philip regarding a comment you made earlier they adapted the Crocker I liked your illustration I never thought about that but people might when we say you have to accept this by faith people might understand that you have to accept this even though you may not understand how this system or the mechanism humor system actually works well I think there is a time where you can do that but I but I think we're now living in a time where we have to understand the evidences of our made and in in Hebrews 11:1 it says that faith is the evidence or the substance and there's a just an interesting thought the substance if you just look at the word sub means under and stance means standing substance is under standing so faith is evidence or understanding so you you have faith because you understand how the mechanism works and you know it will continue to work the reason so so I encourage everybody try to understand because I wish to we should try to understand but we can't there's no way that we're gonna understand yeah all the details of these calendars and how they work in astronomy and and how these are calculated by we can know if we look at some of these things we can know that they work and that they produce the correct dates and as we see prophecy being fulfilled based upon those principles we can then we can know with certainty even if we don't understand all the details because I don't think all of us are going to we can still know with certainty and that's where faith comes because if you look at faith faith is based on evidence but faith is not based upon complete evidence and understanding every little detail we have to know certain things and we know those certain things are solid and then we act on faith on those things and as we exercise faith we begin to trust more and more those those evidences and and so that's the main thing I think that I want people to understand is that we can understand certain levels of this and we can confirm it in various different ways for different people but I don't expect that everybody is going to spend as much time as we are calculating these calendars I can do this really really quickly I can look at every year and look at a ephemeris and I can figure out exactly when the year was and I can count quickly in my head when the tenth day the fifth month is I don't have to use a calculator just because I do it all the time but I wouldn't expect that you would do that that's why we're going to create a website that does this for us but we if we understand the principles that that website is based upon and it's clear then we can trust the dates that it produces as long as we know how we don't have to know exactly all the details but we can trust the the dates and it's something objective we can look at so that that's the main point I think hopefully this helps some people might not help everyone else but the fact that we produce the tenth day of the fifth month in three dates in ezekiel's prophecy one by him lying on his left side another it's just given to us and then the third is just implied because he's talking about the destruction of Jerusalem and that we can take that tenth day as the fifth month as a symbol place it in 2020 and then realize from that that Samuel snows letters produce the same pattern as Ezekiel's vision as the prophecy of revelation 9 and as the reigns of the kings of Judah to me is remarkable yes somebody had a comment it's that as we placed these symbols on the line each line speaks separately to us in it so I see how the tenth day of the fifth month has come out as a symbol but for me to now place the tenth day of the fifth month of July of 2020 I would have to then ask for an explanation of what these things actually mean in each place they're sitting and I don't think we've really proving and explored that okay we've seen a pattern but now what is this power to actually teach us I think we're missing that in this class right well and that's but in order to see what the pattern means which is what we're we're next is our next step I believe we have to know what the pattern is we have to know that it exists in reality but all these patterns like if you have a chiasm it's nice to see a chiasm right is this this is the example Parminder gave but the chiasm is not the truth the cria chiasm reveals the truth it's it's a pattern it's a structure structures are not an end unto themselves structures yield meaning that's why you have structure if you write a poem it's written in a structure and that structure helps amplify the meaning of it not just the words themselves yes but only me I would want to take the tenth day of the fifth month and underneath it right Gregorian Julian biblical rabbinical put the dates that they show up in each and then take each one of those and say on this on this line it means this on this line it means this you know and see the Kampf conglomeration of what attempted the fifth month means under each of those fun calendars were explaining yes other than that is just a bunch of patterns on the board well yes but we here see that this line is showing us the tenth day of the fifth month which we know is the destruction of Jerusalem but attached to it it gives us the midnight cry symbol it has the midnight symbol and it has the July 27th symbol so that one is it connects this tenth day the fifth month to all of our structures already and so then when I'm placing this here and I now see the structures that are typify by these three-way marks with these three dates these three symbols then I can say well this has to refer to the destruction of Jerusalem whatever that means in our time so we have one of the symbols interpreted but we also can take Samuel snows letters and we can see that well this now is simply symbolizing the 10th day of the fifth month even though it's not that in this history because we can do that in 2020 in 2020 this date now symbolizes a new thing that we never noticed before but all of these dates when we went through Samuel snows letters we saw this was the temple dedication this was the Passover but the incorrect one this was not one of his letters but this is the first day of the first month and it's connected numerically to these letters in other lines and then we have May 2nd which is the true Passover and then we have Pentecost June 22nd and so we have in this history we have all these things connected to the temple and to the feasts right so in in this history this is going to alter limit ultimately point to the cleansing of the sanctuary so we have in this line some symbols that relate to millerite history to the beginning of the 2300 days so we would have to believe in our history that Samuel snows letters in this line that points to 20/20 has to deal with the same topic but not the beginning of the cleansing of the sanctuary but the end of the cleansing of the sanctuary in some way how we refine that understanding is going to be based upon other lines right so we have other lines in evidence that we have already presented and I believe there's more lines of evidence regarding 2020 that we haven't yet seen that other people are going to bring us studies similar to what sister Tess has done we're also going to find the same thing for the other dates that different people in this movement are going to be studying lines and connections and they're going to confirm what's going to happen as we pass over the ground God will then have that that that the events that are fulfillments of prophecy as we have these events fulfill as we pass over that ground it will reflect light back on to the past events so the things in the past and that light will shine forward to future events and so we know that as we go through this history those keys will be or those tokens whatever you want to call them they will they will open up our understanding will open up as we move forward in faith but I think we have enough structure here and enough significance that we have to know that God is leading and that as we have moved through these last few weeks we've been fulfilling prophecy and whether we understand it all or not is not really the issue the issue is do we know do we have enough evidence that God is leading this movement and that as we continue to walk by faith he will continue to unveil or unfold this light and I think that something that we you know I personally could never deny this light just because it's so profound and so convincing but if you have doubts about it you need to spend some time researching this and checking these things out for yourself so that's pretty much all I have to say yes sister well I'm having a hard time reading the piece being shot in that they're too tiny or you don't understand me okay so with this with the screenshots what you have is you have the top date is a Gregorian date and then you have some numbers and things you don't need to worry about then it has the Hebrew date and the Julian date and that's all you're looking at those three dates don't worry about all the other stuff it's not important there's a Gyptian calendar on there there's 360 day calendar those are not important it's just those dates that I wanted you see and I want to just you to see how I'm doing this what I'm using what program I'm using is yeah that's a Miss knows last letter if you add up the numbers here I could have put the math in between I guess but if you look at the Julian day number below that and then you look at the next one and the Julian day number you'll see there 391 days apart that's all so you can do the math you can subtract them and and so forth okay but I didn't want to deal with the math of the Julian day number I mean where does it say yeah just look at the Julie it says Julie and day right under the date July 18th and right under the date August 13th it says Julian day if you look at that number and you subtract them you'll see it's three ninety one point five difference Julian day is just a way of another calendar it's counts just the days it doesn't have months if you subtract two three nine five one five seven if you take that number and you subtract from it two three nine four seven six five point five you'll get through one three nine one point five so that's that's just how I do the Julian days those are Julien day numbers but that's a whole other topic and elder Jeff is gonna now present some stuff yes Heidi well we did yesterday what we did yesterday confirms the simple and the literal so you could look at that if you're really struggling and yeah come to terms with it yeah yeah looking at the patterns and saying we have two didn't we can't deny that the patterns in these histories are also similar people who are struggling yeah we may not understand the calendars or the symbols where we can see the patterns are the same okay but maybe if you want us to get to a number like one point five that you put those numbers with trapped in and say this is where I got it we read this okay well you can use this program or the former lab and you can do the math yourself and try to figure it out right yeah I did a whole class on him so the classes that I did was on how to use these calendars and do the calculations yes tamina you wanted to say something about the 26th day from June 22 to July 8th no well there's just 26 days if you add 365 to 26 what do you get 391 but the point that I want to put in place is also in Ezekiel 12 on two witnesses but there's another verse in Ezekiel that says it for me more clearly but in Ezekiel 12 verse 6 it says in their sight shalt thou bear it upon my shoulders and carry it forth in the Twilight thou shall cover thy face and thou shalt nuts and thou shalt see not the ground for I have set thee for a sign unto the house of Israel the point being is I want us to note that Ezekiel's a sign there's a place where he says it real clearly in the same chapter it's repeated again in verse 11 it says say I am your sign like as I have done so shall it be done unto them they shall remove and go into captivity so if someone has a way to search Ezekiel sign you'll see what another verse it says the same thing Ezekiel is a sign that were so just remember that I'm gonna it that I have some logic I want to work through and in closing this off and the idea of Ezekiel being a sign is further down my logic so I won't start there where I want to start is that just some counsel there came a point in time where in Africa you're gonna think what does this have to do with these lines there came a point in time in Africa where some of the Brethren started seeing that the phenomenon that has went on in the United States was going on in their own specific country even I wouldn't I wouldn't doubt that in the near future this phenomenon is going to happen in Brazil because in Brazil they just elected a right-wing Trumpster type president okay and so what I'm saying is in these various countries people are seeing the same phenomenon that's going on in the political arena in the United States happening in their country and they've used the logic the biblical logic that the local corresponds to the worldwide so although the big worldwide picture of prophecy is focused in the United States that there would be they might not say it this way but there'd be a fractal of this event in their own peculiar countries and we got an article some time ago from Zimbabwe it was a good article and I followed the logic and I could see the logic there and they had just elected a president there that was kind of a Trumpster type guy in terms of their culture and he's opening up the the financial doors in that country like Trump is doing so they were putting together this this concept that he gets repeated in Zimbabwe I think it was in Kenya or Tabo ran into the same study in Kenya and when we were in Zimbabwe there's a brother there that we work with that he laid out the same thing happened in in Zambia and then the same thing the same story was coming out of South Africa and so the problem with that is that when you're if there is a problem and I think there is it's not just political if you're if you're looking at the role of the United States and end time Bible prophecy you're looking at it in the context of the final reform movement okay so you're gonna have a reform movement in the glorious land that is focusing on what's going to happen to the United States and it's going to be which future for America has been doing it's it's it's been led to understand that the glorious land is the focus of Bible prophecy and his truth develops over time you can see the last President of the United States is Trump it all comes into into clarity in this movement so if you're looking for this phenomenon in the United States it's not just a political thing you have to see the reform movement you can't separate the reform movement from the political focus of the prophetic message so what began to happen was that is people begin to grapple with this concept well maybe this whole thing's getting repeated in my own country then they also they get led to the next step well then where's the William Miller for this country okay or where's all the the characters of Miller right or Advent history that would show up in our country and and so that started happening okay to the point that there was already concern at a different level that some of the people around planet Earth that we're beginning to be recipients of light that the people that they were associating with in their own sphere of influence we're starting to view them as you know just I'll it you're Samuel snow or Fitch or I know one person that's been identified as the brother that wrote the Daniel in Revelation books not Uriah Smith Haskell it got Haskell identified and and so it was starting to be a problem in the main problem was I don't know if it's the main problem but one of the problems was is that the the personalities that we're getting that seem to be awakening to this light we're young people and it's it's bad enough to be an old person with a little bit of experience and have someone saying oh you've been typify by this person or that person but when you have a young person it's even much more dangerous okay so this message the midnight cry message that we're if that's how we're identifying what tests brought it comes into history over the past four to six weeks and there's brethren around the world that are having difficulty settling into it the way we settled into it and there's no reason for them not to settle into it the people I'm speaking about because they are masters that line up online okay that's the strength of test presentation you two in the back you two in the back they're masters online up online so they should see this logic as well as anyone else but they're not seeing it there initially they are now from what I understand but as it's been looked at the one of the reasons they they couldn't get on board is because they were grappling with this idea that there was going to be a a reform movement in their country that paralleled the worldwide reform movement they may not express it that way but they were identifying that and in that context for as an example if you were going to draw that scenario for Brazil and the the man that was just elected as president in Brazil just got elected a few days ago you know but I probably less than a week so in order for him to accomplish the work that Trump is going to accomplish in Brazil in order for that to work the idea of November 9 2019 it just seemed too unreasonable that that reform movement in this country could play out to the level it needs to play out before November 9 9 2019 so they had a head because they were they were seeing these issues and it connected with these issues was the beginning of identifying well who is the William Miller in our country who is and we've already dealt with that or some of that we I can if I think about it in in this place here we've already interacted with three people at least I think it's more that have been on these premises that identified themselves with Samuel snow one of them went so far to identify himself as Elijah also okay so we've seen this this phenomenon where people start associating themselves with personalities from Miller Rider advent history and we've realized it at least at this point those three Samuel snows are we're not Samuel snow as they were at minimum counter fits okay so I've been saying in here that you know in a minor way I'm gonna try to say it's stronger that I don't think there's a Samuel snow in our history and it seems like when we've been grappling with this particularly when we've been looking at the material that that Theodore opened up no one has said this openly maybe I'm reading it incorrectly and if I am then you know disregard it but it's there seem to be like a little bit of resistance to putting much time and effort into Theodore stuff because it was almost like it was downgrading sister Tess's work okay to the point that we've had even a struggle about how we're going to mark what fulfilled October 13th was this the fulfillment of October 13th it that Theodore was looking on his computer 391 and a half days in the future or was it that Daniel was preaching here or was that that test was preaching there and it was like we were forced to make a decision about what was what and in wasn't really force but what I'm telling to you that I'm seeing is and I've been making this case this particular message is coming from a variety of personalities around the world and there's a danger by of putting the label on some of these young people that the Lord is using and I think it's incorrect anyway okay I want to tell you why I think it's incorrect the this message has always been summarized for 20-some years by verse 44 of Daniel 11 and tidings out of the east and the North shall trouble him okay so when we began to understand the implications of that it's big if you take East and North and define the message in terms of East and North there's all kinds of prophetic lines that you can bring to show what the East is and what the north is in the story the the disobedient prophet that sets forth the prophecy of Josiah we've mentioned it here recently the disobedient prophet dies between the lion and the ass and the ass is Islam it's the message of the East the lion is Rome it's the message of the king of the north okay so those two messages are repeatedly illustrated in Bible prophecy east and north islam king of the north i'm arguing here that what was opened up while tessa was here was the king of the north it's the very beginnings of the Battle of the king of the south and the king of the north and I'm arguing what's being open and up on these 391 year lines is the east this is about Islam it's got it drips with Islam from beginning to end so I know what I'm gonna say is an incorrect question but I have a question for you and I'm gonna argue one side even though I know that neither side is right which witness is the most important witness remember it you're going to bring an accusation against an elder you can't just do it with one witness you have to have to which is the most important witness pardon me she said rome establishes the vision and you'll go with rome you'll go with the with Rome as the first I'll go with the second sister white speaks about there's a quote that we often use where she says the miracles of Christ where evidence of his divinity but knows more a more stronger truth was comparing the prophecies of the Old Testament with the history of the new the first witness was the Old Testament but it isn't confirmed until the second witness of the New Testament comes along and locks it in place so I I'm not sure that I wanted that that you're I'm not sure that I want to argue with you I'm not saying that the the north or the east is more important I'm saying in this in the past two months here what was presented first from my perspective was the north and what got presented second was the East and the East is the witness that is confirming everything about the north I'm not trying to dinner denigrate either one of them but I've been saying also for about from my personal perspective for almost a year now that I was watching a message develop and I was watching I was getting in I was seeing things with that Parminder was putting in place a few things I was discovering something Tyler discovered Tabo discovered I've been watching this message come in to to focus and it's been from a variety of people for instance I don't know I'm sure you all got it too but one of the the most important supports of what we're doing here was George's sermon on Sabbath okay he identified that the Lord is going to open up time in each of these histories but he doesn't do it till right for it's time to happen and here we are it's right before we're overwhelmed with the idea that November 9th is just in front of us it's about to happen we're overwhelmed and then the Lord uses George to show that's the way he always does it ok and I think what's really dangerous Elmo I talks about you know lifting people up and especially these young people that are brand new in this message or they're just years or I mean Tess you can say has been studying for two years and she and you have even said in Parminder has said that she probably doesn't even understand those dates that she's using so the fact that you would lift up these young people to a position of that it's dangerous okay but I wasn't trying to get to that detail of personality it is dangerous for their souls and I think that Satan would have us do that in order to divert us from what we're really supposed to be looking at yes okay but I'm not I don't now I feel like I have to take time about what what partner and I were discussing about those dates and tests I have confidence in the the dates tests put out there and that she understands them that saw the up I don't want to go there I'm not this isn't denigrating anyone I'm saying that as a piece of counsel for this movement at this time I think it's it's time to set aside identifying who is this personality in the movement and that personality until the message gets fully developed and if the Lord wants to put a label on an individual he will do so okay but it's I don't think it's important we got enough stuff opening up now that we have to grapple with that that it would be dangerous for them and it's it's a sidetrack for us even even well we have experienced in that it's it's we were in this work for so many years how many how many years we've been doing this and to think that you know you'd be labeled that was it was scary for me after 20-some years right right okay so getting back to the point I wanna I would once again summarize a couple of thoughts about this here to close it off if I can in 15 minutes it would be nice to have the revelation 9 line up here and then the Ezekiel line up above it where we can see them all in order but we don't need to we've been looking at it repeatedly my argument is is that in Ezekiel's line he's giving us the the the prophesy of Josiah the history of the Kings but he's also giving a living illustration of it by laying on his side his right side and his left side and I'm gonna argue that that's this here this movement has become Ezekiel it's got drawn into the very structure of Ezekiel's prophecy and revelation nines prophecy they have become a sign now they've got they were walking through this okay the idea that at this camp meeting you'll have six days of camp meeting and then it's up here up here and then you have a hundred and twenty minute sermon that opens the Sabbath on 9/11 okay and then it extends out to June 15th and this June 15th is Julian and it's going to connect with June 15th over here Gregorian is tying us in to Revelation 9 with Samuel snows Julian dates for July 27th July 27th and in his gorian date of August 11th it needs that right yes Josiah Lich here this this is connectedness with that but it's also if you notice George if you remember George's presentation and I mentioned it so you have a couple of witnesses to remember what I'm going to say whether it's valid or not as he was going and he was readin have a lot of time but it's he went through those covenant histories where he's shown that right before the probation closes the time is going to be opened up you can see the Lord and those histories begin to put in place symbols that will be used in in time application okay he he pointed to jacob serving seven years and the bible says it was a week so he says okay seven years is defined as a week but also in that passage it says it's a few days so you've got three seven and a week interchangeable terms the lord is beginning to instruct on prophetic application when you get to the story of joseph he mentioned it but i don't know if you've ever thought about it how many double dreams do you have in joseph you have three double dreams that's gotta mean something joseph has a dream of his hip his family bowing down to him double dreams okay then he's in prison and there's double dreams there's the baker and the butler and then pharaoh has double dreams okay there's four what are they that's a double dream I'm counting the butler and the Baker as a double dream but but it's in that what what is what does Joseph say to the butler or to to Pharaoh about those dreams okay it's double done to you then it might be established so right there in that history the very bedrock principle of this movement is upon the testimony of two a thing is established as you go down through these covenant lines what I'm saying is the Lord is not only telling us that before probation closes the LM of time will be recognized he's emphasizing that it would be through prophetic application and he's put in the actual principles in the mix so I'm saying that Ezekiel is an illustration of the 391 but he's given the prophecy of Josiah which is 391 but Ezekiel is illustrating us as a movement we've got drawn into this 391 it's happening in our experience as it did with Ezekiel okay but I'm saying that as these lines go down from Ezekiel to revelation 9 to here there's also a development a prophetic understanding I mean a prophetic the connections that are being made or purposeful okay the connection between the the Julian and Gregorian calendar and revelation 9 is in place so that when we get in here we can see that there's a justification for taking June 15th Julian and making the connection here with this line June 15th Gregorian it's it's based upon revelation 9 if I can say it that way but this here this is - this is too profound okay - denied disregarding the other three lines what we have up here right we'd have three lines above here right you'd have three you'd have the line of the Kings you'd have the line of Ezekiel illustrating it and you'd have Revelation 9 and they're all they're all the same structure essentially you know except for a hundred and fifty be in 120 and that can be resolved okay adds up to seven lines but Daniels prodding Theodore on to look for more lines so we'll see if there's we don't want to get Lockean on seven so you got 120 minutes you got days minutes and even a year here over a year so the hour month day and year is part of Revelation 9:15 all these internal elements but what I'm saying is that this is about Islam more than anything else I don't know if it's about Islam but it's it's dripping with the testimony of Islam which is the message of the East and when it when it comes to mark November 9 2000 19th meeting after sister test marks November 9th 2019 it is the second witness it's the witness from the east that joins with the witness of the north and upon the testimony of two a thing is established I'm hoping we're seeing that therefore I don't know that we have to understand all the calendar work that Theodore does but I think we have to understand this witness we have to understand this witness and I'm arguing at least at one level this is the more important witness not because Tessa's isn't the most important message I'm not saying that but her message needs a second witness to establish it and and this was it and it came right at the the identical time I'm not sure if you can say if there is a more important witness because the second one wouldn't mean anything if there wouldn't be a first one I said that from the outside I said it from the outset I know you're gonna challenge me that I know they're both equal but you're at least getting my point because we're all we're all line up online people so we could watch sister tests and when she got to the conclusion she did not have to point to November 9th 2019 everyone ran up the board and did it for her because we'd followed her line up on line but as we watched Theodore it's a whole different ball of wax when he's done we're not running up there putting it in place okay so he all I'm saying is his is it has to be understood as equal because it's about confirming this here but if you're not following this I'm a little bit concerned about a nut concern but I know most of us have been in this class but Bronwyn hasn't the past couple if you have and I tried to show her this about four five days ago and in our house on our on our whiteboard it fell apart at that point this was last Friday or something and but now this is airtight okay six days 120 minutes six 120 126 lead lead you to 391 brings you into six days from June 9th to June 15th a hundred and twenty days takes you to October 13th 391 and a half days takes you to November 9th midnight Ezekiel 20 the structure to notice is it has a chiasm in here that from this point starting point to this way mark 63 days takes you to the center and this this just blows my mind you got 911 you got July 27th you got August 11th and you have the mathematical formula which is 2001 yeah times times 360 equals 723 60 yeah divided by 1840 equals 391 and a half so this here is putting an emphasis on 2001 and 18-49 11th August 11th and it's putting an emphasis on the restraint of Islam in two histories so this this is telling us is LOM and the testing this is where the testing in both of those histories again we apply the same zekiel 20 verse 1 as we do to 2020 putting the zero designator for the place marker for the one you know 1000 is 0-1 it becomes 2001 so 20 2001 following what I hear yeah so you're also saying it's not as good as this one okay you're saying over here he put a zero in there place marker for one yeah mm so it's 2001 Ezekiel 20 verse one is pointing to 2001 as well okay yeah so what I'm winning Bronwen to see cuz she didn't sit in this class all of you to see it again is that in this this structure which is an extension of this structure you can't separate them why can't you separate them well one of the reason you can't separate them is because of Sabbath and 9/11 and out at 9/11 the ceiling of the hundred and forty-four thousand began and the seal is the Sabbath and at 9/11 here when Sabbath began this year that this particular year we're putting out and 9/11 over here when Sabbath ended that connection there 9/11 Islam the Sabbath the seal it ties these two lines together and these two lines are identical this one here has this chiasm okay so when when the theodor for whatever reason gets led to jump to to consider 2020 and he uses that as a starting point because of July 18th and he backs up and has the identical structure with the identical chiasm of 6363 and six days 120 days this time period that that right there is is it that's all you need to write okay that's it but when you realize after the fact that these dates that are produced on the Julian remember revelation nine is the transition from Julian July 27 I 27th of Gregori in August 11th that's about Islam all of these are julienne dates and we've already been handling Samuel snows publications and we realize that all of these julienne dates correspond to the Gregorian dates in the history of Samuel snow and in doing so they produce the identical structure with the chiasm what it's saying is is that what we're understanding about this here was so important that when the Lord opened it up to this movement he immediately at the same time provided a second witness and the second witness was not that much fun compared to the word first witness because we're all line upon line people but this is line upon line - but it's not historical lines its timelines and it made it more difficult but there's no way that this can be invented and then when you when you project this out from July 18th here to July 18th down here and you you come - from June 22nd to here and you come to two dates one of them is when Miller's writing his apology and defense and the other one is when it's published and all of these are about writing and publish Minh and this would be an extension of this line what - tell us about that what was the mill what was Miller doing in 1845 saying I'm telling I'm sorry world that I said the Lord was coming back on 1843 and 1844 thereafter but I want to tell you if if it was all said and done I'd do it all over again okay and when does he make this 1845 in the history of the 45th President of the United States okay there or in the history of Revelation 18 any way you want to look at it okay so this what we're handling here now the second witness if nothing else what I what I want to put in the mix for this movement that watches these classes is that this message right now with what test brought and these lines of 391 it's the my tidings out of the east and the north as this this message has been from the very beginning it's Daniel 11:40 for but it is now so profound but forget the profundity of it it's so scary it's November 1st today is it so we got a year and 8 days before we get to November 9th it's so scary it's so profound I'm guaranteeing that one of the things we do not need to be spending our time doing is looking around for who it is that is tip of been typifies by someone in the Miller right or the Advent history it's it's not the focus of study that the Lord has opened up for us he's showing that we're repeating the history of the midnight cry but he's not making into demands that we figure out who is Samuel snow if he's going to do that let him do it in his own ways and means but I'm telling you that the work gets finished by an army of youth that are well trained and I tell you what it is dangerous for youth to begin thinking that they're this person or that person and if you're going to contribute to that kind of mindset I think you're you're going the wrong direction there's enough to deal with with this message to try to put it together to not clutter the study with that other stuff and I haven't spoken to Parminder I know summer like his input as much as anyone else's input I haven't spoken to him directly about it but I've got email from him on this subject we are on the same wavelength as this okay he's the one that emailed me and said hey I'm realizing now that the Brethren that were a little bit hesitant were hesitant because they they couldn't figure out how November 9th could fit in to the repetition of the reform movement that they expected to take place in their own country okay there just wasn't enough time so I think this is is a not just me shall we pray Heavenly Father we are overwhelmed with the seriousness of what you've opened up to us it appears that Methuselah has just died and we know full well that the year that he dies the flood comes and we've been working for a hundred and nineteen years and now we realize all we have left is a year we know that this movement is according to your will and your plan so that you're fully prepared to finish the work that you began in each of us if we will but participate and you're fully prepared and ready to finish your work on planet Earth so we thank you for the possibility the privilege of participating in this work ask that you use the serious nature of this message to bring even greater conviction on each of us to do our due diligence and our responsibilities but we can't help but thank you for the the wonderful rain that you've been pouring upon us both with tidings from the north and tidings from the east but we see there's still some answer unanswered issues we ask that you continue to allow us to put these issues in the right context that this message can come into perfect clarity and we thank you for these things in Jesus name Amen