(10-24-17) - Afternoon - Revelation 14 - (ZMTxwa-YMd8)

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Publish Date: 10/25/2017
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Language: English
Channel Group: ASOTP
YouTube Title: (10-24-17) - Afternoon - Revelation 14-ZMTxwa-YMd8
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so yesterday we were looking at some Christ object lessons page 62 chapter 3 so I'll let you find it and I'll begin reading from the beginning of chapter the problem of the sir excited much questioning some of the heroes gathered from it that Christ was not to establish an earthly Kingdom and many were curious and perplexed seeing their perplexity Christ used other other illustrations still seeking to turn their thoughts from the hope of a worldly kingdom to the work of God's grace in the soul and he said so is the kingdom of God as if a man should cast seed into the ground to sleep and rise night and day in the siege has screened up and grow up he knows not how for the earth bringeth forth fruit of herself first the blade then the ear after that the full corn in the ear but when the fruit is brought forth immediately he put it in the sickle because the harvest has come and this is where we got sort of ground to a halt yesterday the husbandmen who pull it in the sickle because the harvest has come can be no other than Christ it is he who at the last great day will reap the harvest of the earth but the sower of the seed represents those who labor in Christ's stead the seed he said to spring up and grow he knows not how this is not true of the Son of God Christ does not sleep over his charge what what is it day and night he's not ignorant of how the seed grows so if you remember the study that we as it went through yesterday we were turned to Revelation 14 and particularly I think this verse it is it verses 14 and 18 so I'm gonna go with verse 14 they looked and behold a white cloud and upon the cloud one set and like unto the Son of man having his head having on his head a golden crown and in his hand a sharp sickle and then 18 no 17 sorry with 14 and 17 then another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven he also having a sharp sickle so you've got two angels having a sharp suit her one of them is looks like the Son of Man and the other one is just a regular angel and we were discussing those angels are have a look we spoke yesterday they will say the same thing are they different things you think that the review and Herald 100k which is the most personal one the one that movie's most Foucault's mr 3:11 because it had some wording in there okay brother Luke were you involved in that study before they discussion yeah and he's checking that you were part of that study that Robert I was talking about yeah when did last night so just give a suggest without what the quote says of what you give your permitting run that I can give it what what are you learning from 13m our great mr 3:11 human agency studies so the more people the more people that he use they use by the heavenly agencies then with greater the harvest I would never write that how would you describe it probably yeah so we looked at Matthew 13 okay I think it was like 37 through 46 I have to go to Matthew and so we were looking at where it says Christ is the one where the angel that says the Reapers are the Angels mm-hmm and so then we asked a question last night who are the Reapers are they just the Angels so we came to realize that in mr3 11 and it's not just the reef changes its Christ and angels and tucks that sister-wife tells us or the Reapers we have a part to play with them in reaching eiders that cried in the harvest okay so there aren't enough workers yep over widget okay sister olivine verse 14 verse 17 what we say revolution 18 the experience that takes place on the revolution well member nothing is that which she brought up yesterday for me was something I never considered so I don't have time enough okay let me process that's what I mean did she move ages 1 9 1 perhaps 4:35 4 5 and then 9 1 9 2 point 1 is it is that these three paragraphs yes ok says well as Jesus sat still sat at the well site we looked over the fields of grain that was spread out before him their tender green touched by the golden sunlight pointing his disciples to the scene he employed it as a symbol say not ye there are yet four months and then cometh the harvest behold I say unto you lift up your eyes and look on the fields for they are white already to harvest and as he spoke he looked on the groups that were coming to the well it was four months - the time for harvesting the grain but he was the harvest ready for the Reaper he that reapeth he said with seafood wages and gathereth fruit unto its life eternal that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together I'm hearing is that saying true one sowing and another reap it hid price points out the sacred service to God by those who received the gospel there to be his living agencies he requires an individual service and whether we sow or reap we are working for God once that is a seed another gathers in the harvest and both the solar and the Reaper receive wages they rejoice together in the reward of their labor Jesus said to the disciples I sent you to reap that whereon you bestow in my labor other men labor then he entered into their labors the Seder was here looking forward to the great in gathering on the day of Pentecost that is how the disciples were not to regard this as a result of their own efforts they were entering into other men's versus the fall of Adam crates have been committing the seed of the word to his chosen servants to be sown in human hearts and an unseen agency even an omnipotent power had worked silently but effectually to produce the harvest the Jew and rain that sunshine of God's grace had been given to oppression nourish to see the truth Christ was about toward to the scene with his own blood his disciples were privileged to be laborers together with God they were co-workers with Christ and with the holy men of old by the outpouring of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost thousands were to be converted in a day this was a result of Christ selling the hardest of his work so I'm just recognizing from that those three paragraphs that they're so isn't this Reapers but they won't both work together as co-laborers with Christ what passage will we live here yeah I was thinking about something else so it seemed to me that yesterday there was a bit of confusion about chapter 14 that these two reaping what were they referring to verses 14 and 17 and I think in great controversy chapter 40 which is page 635 and onwards it seemed to me that there seemed to be some kind of clarity on this subject 6:35 chapter 40 God's people delivered doing just that that's where would some we ended up there a couple of us who've just read through this most of most of chaps are actually I think we went through and he seemed in my mind at least to clarify some of the issues so I probably begin around 636 paragraph 2 GC Suraiya GC six three six paragraph two is at midnight that God manifests his power for the deliverance of his people Sun appears shining in its strength signs and wonders following quick succession the wicked look with terror and amazement upon the scene while the righteous behold his solemn joy the tokens of their deliverance and then she's going to quote from revelation 16 verse 17 after all this it's done it says whence comes the voice of God like the sound of many waters saying it is done Revelation 16 17 that voice shakes the heavens and the earth there is a mighty earthquake such as was not since there were men upon the earth so mighty an earthquake so great verses 17 and 18 so this is the seven last plagues we will agree with that so we're in the history of the seven last plagues and I've understood this to be the close of probation to the second advent is everybody agree with that so there's an earthquake virtually seventeen and eighteen what what plague number is that sorry 2/7 play sit the earthquake the seventh one let's list them out so let's list all the seven plagues up six buggy two stages but one is the sea and what is the rivers okay the second is to see the four third is the rivers for business son fifth is darkness six is the great river euphrates dried up seventh is the poured out the bonds of air that have a great voice where's thunders and lightnings and earthquakes that was the seventh so we always know another be hail the hail I think that's part of it so we can spike well it's right in that one seventeen eighteen nineteen twenty twenty-one so he's that number seven eight yes it's an earthquake and hail does that actually do anything to thunder and lightning like a plate okay thunder and light so do we all agree that's for seven plates they were pretty creepy that that's 21 so the higher they look like it's like there's the pronouncement of the plague with voices thunders and lightning you said only the last one doesn't play I'm just reading it as a trace because like 1918 telling us is great earthquake and the first one is the saw the second one is the blood in this see third one is rivers become blood the fourth the Sun scorches the fifth the darkness sixth the review Freitas dries our sixth and the seventh is but as you say verses 17 to 21 which is the great voice and would you get in that great voice you get an earthquake and you get hail is that right yes so we're back in great controversy he says is that midnight that God manifests his power for the limits of his people the Sun appears shining in its strength signs and wonders following a quick succession the way he looked with terror and amazement upon the scene while the writers behold with solemn joy the tokens of their deliverance everything can they just seem to turn out of its course the stream ceased to flow dark heavy clouds come up and clash against each other in the midst of the angry heavens is one clear space of indescribable glory whence comes the voice of God like the sound of many waters saying it is done their voice shakes the heaven and the earth there is a mighty earthquake such as was lost since so from chapter 46 3:5 and onwards we see that all of this is the seventh plague is that how we're seeing that I just just I just spread from the top of the page I didn't actually read the six three five says God's people delivered and then I cut in at six three six paragraph two it is at midnight I'm basing that upon the fact that chapter 39 before he's the time of trouble which is the history of the plagues but now this whole chapters devoted to the seventh and last plague just want to make sure we're all on the same page we're all seen that the same way we didn't go back into the previous chapter but as for you if you do I think you'll see that it's going to list out the plagues so if we're here this is the seventh plague this is number seven it is the midnight that God manifests his power for the deliverance of his people so I'm appears shining in its strength signs an wonders follow me quick succession the Ricky look with terror and amazement upon the scene while the writers behold with solemn joy the tokens of their deliverance everything King Aegeus seems turned out of its course stream ceased the flow dark heavy clouds come up against and clash against each other in the midst of the angry heavens is granted space of indescribable glory whence comes the voice of God like the sound of many waters saying it is done that voice shakes the heavens and the earth there is a mighty earthquake such as was not since men were upon the earth so mighty an earthquake and so great the firmament appears to open and shut the glory from the throne of God seems flashing through the mountains shake like a reed in the wind and ragged rugged rocks are scattered on every side there is a roar as of a coming tempest the Seas lashed into fury there is heard the shriek of a hurricane like the voice of demons upon a mission of destruction the whole earth heaves and swells like the waves of the sea its surface is breaking up his very foundation seems to be giving away melting chains are sinking inhabitant islands disappear the seaports that have become like Sodom for wickedness are swallowed up by the angry waters Babylon the Great has come in remembrance before God to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath great hailstones everyone about the weight of a talent are doing their work of destruction as verses 19 and 21 proudly cities are of the earth too laid low the lordly palaces upon which the world's great men have lavished their wealth in order to glorify themselves are crumbling to ruin before their eyes prison walls are rent asunder and God's people who have been held in bondage for their faith are set free so where in this history here what's happening we're set free and the mountains are collapsing and the seaports flooded so I guess the main thing I wanted us to see was that we're freed them then he says graves are open then many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth awake some to everlasting life and some to shame and everlasting contempt Daniel 12:2 all who have died in the faith of the third angels message come forth from the tomb glorified to hear God's covenant of peace with those who have kept his law they also which pierced him revelation 1:7 those that mocked and derided Christ dying Agony's and the most violent of poses of his truth and his people are raised to behold him in his glory to see the honor placed upon the Royal the loyal and obedient so this is a special resurrection isn't it and who's going to be raised here right which ones who have died sorry the ones that are in the third angels message okay so the third angels message they're resurrected who else okay so the time of Christ who involved him anyone else okay taste think about those opposes he says the most violent of poses on his truth and of his feet people's so this would be get up the word sinners is a so when it says it's right it says the most violent opposer so I just called them the worst sinners the people who are the worst so when it says obey also who pierced him and mocked him derided Christ in these dying Agony's is this the people at the cross they also which pierced in those that mocked and derided Christ dying Agony's yeah he prophesied of them so is it right those who revolving at the cross we all agree with that reviled lot no it's not locked it's worse than locked if you revile someone you say curses or hate hateful things against them yeah so Busey likewise who swore it Jesus when he was dying you know I cannae so would that be the soldiers say that wasn't like that so hence my question is it just those people who do that or is it all the people because he can't be every single person he's gonna be resurrected who just was bad is it those people specifically at the cross because they had a first-hand experience of who Jesus was they were without excuse as well so up to what time does the special those who partake of the special resurrection up to what time in history delay up to what time in history are those who are going to be partakers of the special resurrection what time that be up to four at least everyone Tuesday and up to here everyone's day so up to this point you've got over the wiki who are living and 144,000 of living so everyone prior to that is already dead so I'm asking which one of those dead are gonna come up and resurrect again says those also was Pierceton those that mocked and derided Christ dying Agony's so in that special resurrection I'm thinking be those who were literally there mocked him as he's going through those no final scenes of his life in that content started me yeah maybe that the natural people mother Tyler yeah so you think that would be the soldiers yes I'm talking about which says that you pissed him this soldiers what they'd says those who their partner brother returned Mark tonderai the card that month underwriting repeater their Lord it was I thought that the priests had a part to play in that as well so it's the priest soldiers soldiers that's a lil deep sorry I came late can you come I can explain me what you just where we were looking at Revelation 14 14 and 17 and trying to understand a little bit about dynamics of that reaping and how it's working so we just reading from GC chapter 40 great controversy chapter 6 3 6 paragraph 2 I think and we're just looking at and we're it's where the whole chapter is the seventh and last play talks about special resurrection when the earthquake happens and it says those who revolved Jesus at the cross and those who pierced him so it's the soldiers do actually think is the soldiers who actually did the piercing they're the ones that going to be resurrected yeah we are they just doing their job don't even know we're doing another woman's played a part in it but was later church to church because like when you read about is it even that read about chaos when he stood before Christ and Ellen White said that he had a view of Christ coming in the clouds she said ever since that point he live with torment I you would be that special resurrection as well if it was a good statement it was me okay so we're going to make that literal if I'm okay with that does anybody have looks anywhere else that they can see that I'm just having a quick look now at the trial I wonder when he was before Herod those soldiers what we were just doing their job with the crown of thorns didn't I say that they should scars you but the Crown's sticking it somehow well I always wondered about is you know if you work for the wrong person the wrong time even though you might claim to be innocent you end up being guilty because they guess you have a choice I mean they do you have to mock in wonder I do as they did the question or adult statement they can work this if you went for a bad King you're gonna be in trouble from God and you can't use the argument that I'm just a soldier and I just follow orders I tell you why I'm just waiting from Sciences time January 28 1903 paragraph a all I'm just quoting is from that revelation 1:7 they also which pierced them so that there's there's a number of quotes that say this but this one here says these words apply not only to the men who pierced Christ when he hung on the cross of Calvary but also to those who by evil speaking and wrongdoing are piercing him today daily yourself as the Agony's of the crucifix in daily men and women our person him by dishonoring him by refusing to do his will so she's applying this in a kind of a spiritual way but that would mean that everybody would raise that special resurrection if you make it too broad brush it I think it's specifically doing with those people and so my question was and these soldiers as innocent as we might think they are they must not be I think because we don't even understand the hitch we don't know who they were you know we just think they just following orders it's not their fault but getting wrapped up into something even when it's not your fault you can be too severe trouble what exactly what about if they said we don't want to do that those you won't even kill straight when you don't have a choice they're soldiers and it's your job because they used to have set teams so then if you've ever done it to watch the documentary on how these things work it's a set team who does the scourging it's a it's a two-man team that does it because end up getting so tired yeah I mean you think that I don't know how they do it but the person that they're flogging it can take a lot of punishment and these men actually get high so it's a two-man team to do this job and that's basically all their job it's just a fog people say they could do more than 40 right yeah tell me what the yeah something that they don't wear the number is and they've gotten ladies capes and all that kind of mess I mean it's really bad yes he has said they that pieced me and then why say it doesn't apply only to the men who literally pierced him no reference and that was st January 28th 1903 paragraph paint yep beginners question when is the specialist resurrection area I understand before the second advent but to those people who come out of the graves and see the sea there the little black cloud you haven't got the background yet so we're right here when the seventh plague and what's just happened is there's an earthquake at the earthquake which you got to the earthquake bit then it says a special resurrection much times do sisters just a day I get no idea I've no idea how long it is it doesn't say if I suspect it's not too short time but I don't know so the revolved people who who pierced him and do all this work and the priests the soldiers I'll put the Roman I put the Jews here and the Romans and then she said the worst of sinners the most violent of sinners and I assume that means through the centuries those people who had the most aggressive against Christianity they'll be specially resurrected so that's why I've got worse sinners what came to my mind about those soldiers I can't remember this who's the king they want to Elisha sitting on the hill and these soldiers in 50 come and your captain he's there and he's rude you see Elijah Elijah I think it's Elijah have a quick look and you made them become blind no not that story co-fired on what he calls bar yeah yeah yeah Elijah yeah okay yeah second Kings pick up from verse night then the king sent unto him a captain or fifty with his fifty he went up for him and behold he sat on the hill top of the hill he spake unto Him thou man of God the King hath said come down he like your ass and said to his Cathy were fifty if I be a man of God then that fire come down from heaven and consume thee and by fifty they came down fire from heaven and consumed him in his fifty I'm just thinkin you at the back of the queue or the thing this you're just doing there you don't need what you're doing you're thinking about lunch or your family and you just going to get killed just cause you're part of that group then 11 he sends another 50 and the same thing happens and then he sends a third one and I'm sure that all those 50 men are and paying close attention there and you that's verse 13 and then now when he comes he begs Elisha he's learned his lesson he begs him please come and then he lies you says okay I'll spare your life so I just found it interesting that no one's innocent none of us are innocent like anything bystanders rule we're all guilty at some level well the soldiers actually did the piercing yeah quite oh don't hate from ms1 55:19 - and and they also which pierced him not only does this apply to those who last saw Christ when he hung on the cross of Calvary but to those who buy wrong words and actions are piercing in today yeah that's the one we just wait a minute grandpa okay so the the point I was making well that is all of us a piercing Christ what is that word is Paul say they crucify Christ afresh so at that level all of us are crucifying him afresh but the special resurrection is for a unique group of people over the 6,000 years who have done particularly bad crimes and I'm guessing one of the ones that are particularly bad is those people who were living at that time period who had an opportunity to know what Luke who and what Christ was the first two are in the past that the last is until the end of time yes yeah even the last one might be the worst of sinners it still some to come yeah she looks just might give a list of like like some of the most evil wicked man I think Nero was one of them so I imagine those type of people would be like yeah worse or something but what my other question of what is she says the cars gonna make some like the people that were enslaved we're gonna be as though they never work how does that dynamic work kind of it they were just basically I guess their growth was just done it so the point they couldn't even make a choice how do they just cease to exist okay that's it that's it that's it mostly sorry you can address that one every question I strayed this there is narrow that monster of cruelty in Vice yep but Larry my question is why does Christ resurrect this not so that they will repent it seems like so that he will be justified but in his life even when they accused him he didn't say anything he was me why what's the purpose of raising them up so they can see Christ okay so okay before we answer that one let's just tackle this third angel since doe she died under the third angels message where do we mark that from those who died under the third angels message say wasn't that the verse we read yesterday the revelation 14:13 okay so read that day read 1413 and I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me write blessed are the Dead which die in the Lord from henceforth yes safe the spirit that may rest from their labors and their works okay so it says best of those that died what where do we mark that from you would say from this something henceforth through work ways to henceforth from afar doing a go back to henceforth sorry in the Greek is from now okay yeah so still me to say from this point on from when these are now from now contextually from verses 9 to 11 from that from on from when that's given when is that my D goes against everything else that I learned in that personal but looking at it more again I'm thinking they'll have to be from verdiant message with the market for Sunday night so now here Tyla I've never looked at it super closely but for my understanding it's it's when the flirting was message was first given all the way Miller in time presenting me 44 yeah as opposed to some technicality before that from here this issue what I said 1844 as well but this would mean there a sense that mr. Dyk that's in 1950 and a period of darkness and he died during the third angels message and he would be resurrected on the right side even though maybe everything that I think he said spike since 1844 yesterday we went back to the fifth seal that was meaning that the the martyrs of the 70 and the 1260 or white of the 1260 are waiting until their fellow-servants are sealed the same way so we're waiting for the bloodshed what was the quote that says you with the 144,000 nobody know that quote yeah c18 98.2 what's your type piece you wonder doesn't he's built hanky 344,000 the number boss caused a stir I think that what did they said you must go back see take CET 98.2 is it licit rate sister sister Letha she's like that I thought find her straightaway then I was taken to a world with seven moons there I saw good old Enoch which had been translating had been translated on his right arm he bore glorious palm and each leaf was written victory let me skip down I asked him if this was the place he was taken to from the earth he said it is not the city is my home and I have come to visit this place he moved about the place as he perfectly at home I begged of my attending angel to let me remain in that place I could not bear the thought of coming back to this dark world again then the angel said you must go back and if you are faithful you with the hundred forty four thousand she'll have the privilege of visiting all the worlds and viewing the handiwork of God does that mean anything and if that's the you either presenting anyway and all those who died there that's the point then examine every simply Adventist they don't have you filled up the third engine from there only oh Lisa V Adventists so we don't like that you don't use I don't believe what they say they like you so if we come back to here 1798 we're here at the fourth seal and we go to revelation 6 verses 9 to 11 and when he had opened the fifth seal I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held so they killed where for the word and the testimony where's the altar so what about a symbol of in this context holy place ministry okay Christ holy place ministry Christ Holy Face ministry I guess you need to go back to the sanctuary system and where we do wait wait wait you see that the blood is poured at the base of the altar okay someone find that so it's not not I'm gonna I'm gonna write in case you guys find it the one is the brazen altar you pour blood at the base and two there's the the altar of incense no the lodge which ones that form this is the altar so this Exodus can you eat that thou shalt take of the blood of the bull and put it upon the ones at the officer with thy finger pour also the blood beside the bottom of the altar yeah so we found that one maybe we won't be able to find this one if someone could even it even of today we can find that one cuz I'm not familiar with this one the altar of incense is roads not he says there's the braised altar the altar of incense and he says no blood is supposed to come upon the altar okay yeah she said he's up for number two and the priest shop with some of the blood upon the horns of the altar of sweet incense before the Lord yeah she sees already said it except on the day of atonement that you can see she's aware of that I'll put it down Leviticus four seven four seven okay we'll never find that but it was this one here I looking at it's poured upon the base my understanding was that the author of the brazen altar is a symbol of the earth where Jesus was sacrificed so you have the earth which is the brazen altar is the iron Orion and then the holy place and in the most holy place are in heaven this is Earth and this is where Jesus was killed many ministers in heaven that's how I understood that so what it says at the base of the altar it's those people who are dead I think I have that I think it's going to work because it's just so 611 3 6 9 and when he had opened the fifth seal I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held and they cried with a loud voice saying how long O Lord holy and true dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth so where would we go to 10 Abel where is Abel's blood cry what's the verse I was blood the Christ he shall burn incense upon it a perfect --well incense before the Lord throughout your generation he shall offer no stranger since your honor no birth sacrifice nor meat offering neither shall eat or drink offering Aaron and Aaron shall make an atonement upon the horns of each in a year once in a year with the blood of the still offering of atonement once in the ear shall atone ok so that's putting that stupid on the horse well you can't do a small burnt offering and also so there can be no sacrifice a would you want to pray for peace for Jenny sees what Genesis 4:10 3 that the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground okay so that's the alcohol other argument I would have that they cried with a loud voice saying avenge our blood on them that dwell on is this their blood is crying and it's from the ground which is beneath the altar verse 11 and robes were given unto every one of them and it was said unto them that they should rest yet for a little season until their fellow-servants and also their brethren that should be killed as they were should be fulfilled so this is 1798 we okay with that yeah this is the fifth seal and this was the fourth seal so they killed under the fourth seal then they speak at the fifth seal and the fifth stilled is only a point in time it doesn't add doesn't have any history connected to it so the sixth seal begins here in 1798 and we move forward but the fifth so this is this conversation between these dead people and God and they need to do what what do they need to do not what they want they need to wait until what here so I've put the number four here which is where they're gonna be killed agree with that how do we do how do we make that connection from here to here that's what 16 do that's sort of nowhere okay so this is a 1260 working with that but how we're making the connection where we can mean no okay so we're not gonna go there well I'll give you the rest of that in a second a bit bit of logic how we're gonna connect these together sending lots of persecution begins and let's simplify the 1260 window people are slaughtered that's when that number is made up okay so use walking persecution and persecution but persecution by the papal power that's - that's what I saw - together and the paper season back on the throne and Sunday long okay next our thinking some mercies you had your hand up brother Johnny yeah where are you taking six it says we know it's talked about the papacy and it says a reward her even as she rewarded you and double unto her double according to her works in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double so we see at me papacy gets a double punishment because they were not punished for the time period of the 1260 okay by hacking away the way to place verse 6 that you just say what's up to this one you know here she's gonna be punished here but how you sunny how'd you from verse 6 how you play some way verse 6 it how can you place verse 6 after close of probation because after the close of probation papers you kind of work anymore they cannot deceive somebody what are you picking up from that verse I'm picking up that the papacy gets punished twice okay so why did they get punished twice tell me why because they didn't get punished during 1260 why then they get punishments 1260 they get killed here yeah but they didn't get they didn't get punished for example like Babylon that the kingdom just was gone so that's the first thing that they did you know where's the second thing that they did so that's the point you're making yeah she does since she sings twice so she's gonna get doubled punishment she's gonna get the punishment for this one and the punishment for this one okay but still looking for an argument to connect these two together you still she Miller I'm just wondering how you came unto this from I know idea the reason of the week we came from it because we're looking at this judging they've made the connection here to here first other people in this part of the room verse 12 verse 11 they need to rest a while until their fellow-servants also and their brethren that should be killed as they were should be fulfilled 611 so the question is when were they killed and the people are saying here since they're killed here I put the fourth and the fourth together that's that's the connection that I'm making so I'm saying pythons had to be happy they tie them together big structure what's the chiasm midpoint if you didn't make it a chiasm yes fabric so the 1260 from the sunday lots of probation isn't no I'm awesome to the proof of it I'm not saying it so badly I mean it's good enough to sort of say that I'm asking how we connecting that together what's a what's a strong logic for doing that 5:38 which one runs back revelation 18 now I want a logic first we did it quite afterwards okay what is the logic we just is that we is that I mean if that's all we've got that's that's fine plays anymore yay what was it for both you both clients for sale default not positive fourth church to make it tight IRA Roth IRA or the for still for sale check the new face of rule so that's the face of Rome here and where's the face of Rome so unless the king of the north is somewhere over here or this somewhere over here so really keen to the North before 89 okay we discussed that William starts right the prosecution okay bye pull up the Bible verse that's all that one this is a parish you say puffy Oh from John Thomas Thomas from Tyler what is there a quote you want through that we're not allowed to read what he wasn't he was to pull up if you got you Study Bible there's a quote for Revelation 6:9 to 11 that talks about this she's going to tell you that this history here will be fulfilled in Revelation 18 basically then what I don't fully understand the question of what we're trying that location is okay the question is these people here who died under the third angels message how does it say in the passage great controversy yeah we're in the great controversy all who have died in the faith of the third angels message come forth from the tomb glorified so the question is where did where is the third angel being marked from because in history marks from 1844 or is it the Sunday law one and in this one are we saying that it's every single Adventist all through this darkness and everything is it is it talking about that or is it talking about only those people who died here so I guess the question that is being asked when it says those who died on the third angel is is how can you die what the two ways are dying no not true okay arm Archer Oh malted MIT for a male yeah are you a army so are these when these people who died under third agent are they the ones that just died naturally or they martyrs all these people are just these millions of Adventists or hundreds of thousands other than the four millions is it talking about those ones you just died because you were there or is those people who died under a specific cause and we're picking it up from Revelation 14 verse thirteen fourteen thirteen there 14 13 yeah and I heard a voice from heaven saying unto them write blessed are the Dead which die in the Lord from henceforth so the hence the gospel when is the henceforth is it 1844 or is it Sunday law I mean someone might argue it might be 9/11 or something but we just got these two ones so then what we went what we went to revelation 6 it's revelation 6 there's a group of people who were killed for the word and their testimony it talks all about all of their situation then that's the fifth seal and then it says they want vengeance because they they've been killed under 1260 and he says wait until another group of killed just as you were then people have said that happens here so I'm asking for the proofs to connect them together and so brother Jonathan went to Revelation 18 6 it says double unto her double and he said the reason it's doubled is because they need double killing this history in this history so I said okay that's very enough but still looking for the proof to get from here to here to tie them together properly properly but in both verses it talks about the same people are persecuted or a martyr both of them have to arrest so that's one of their uh well in Chapter six they're told to rest and then you see the same three a blessed are his idea was dying little off henceforth he said the spirit that they may rest from their labors and their works do follow them for the same people to be persecuted there you see that connection of arrest I think that's another point in these they come together so hey hey you gonna mark arrest twice under law close of probation as far as death is concerned and here you're gonna mark arrest yes in verse 9 of chapter six their slain for the word of God and for the testimony okay so I've got like worded text Emily yes so their labors in chapter fourteen they rest from their labors and their works do follow them so I'm just suggesting that the reasons they die in chapter six which is the word of God and the testimony their works in their labors in chapter fourteen so that's the same thing their works in their labors that they're dying for the Word of God and the testimony let's go back to here what's happening 538 brother Tyler good so there's a Sunday law where is that someone else yeah where was it yeah everybody know that all in Orleans so hey Dan Sally oh that's probably where European only on properly okay so they did that down south Sunday law so you got Sunday law and Sunday love who's got that connection yeah so you've got a hard connection there revelation 17 so where would you go where would you find it in revelation 17 let's make the other connection here's what this is the real connection I think yes you didn't give me the verse okay so what's the main thing that you picking up here sister on the V the main phrase although or the main thing that you picked up from that verse which one you wanna go for not not particularly word but there's loads of people there's lots of people being killed all the way through history there's many people that have been killed because of worship I would suggest our it's the image of the Beast is the key phrase yeah image means copy so the cross that out we call it the copy of the beast so in revelation 17 which verses to tarrick said when they make war the lamb in verse 14 revelation 17 oh he's up 1714 yeah 1714 these shall make war with the lamb and the lamb shall overcome them for he is Lord of lords and king of kings and they that are with him are called and chosen and faithful so how did you how you making the connection with this history in this history in verse 14 treads down the sights okay who are these 1798 a close of probation for hope the probation for whom I'm asking I know you but you're asking if it was if it was who would it be close of probation before for a papacy since the close of probation with the papacy can you prove that yeah so if we went to Daniel 9 Daniel 9:27 the last part of the paragraph of this raid the first very last I read the verse another fella where he is and he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and oblation to cease and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate then this is bit even unto the consummation and you were there and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate have you got a marginal reading there he says what the desser no Daniel 9:27 Daniel 9:27 and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate that's like that means the one who's doing it so there's a detail something determined and that determined which means like there's a decree or there's a law that's already been issued they shall be poured upon the Desolator so I'm saying that who is the Desolator in that history yeah because if you go back one verse go to the very end of the verse 26 had you noticed the papacy what's the what's the word that you're gonna see for papacy in 26 no did you see that think about revelation 12 language okay so you can see so the flood there in 26 is the pay is the Desolator in 27 so there's a there's a there's a structure there anyway there's a nice repeating alized pattern in those two verses so it says that what that has been determined he's going to be poured upon the desolate err which is what the deadly wound like that you said which is the close of probation so you've got close of probation here so you've got the Sunday law close the probation Sunday law close the probation because this close the probation is for whom no you just said it's the papacy yeah didn't you that's fine but there's no close of probation here but you're but you're you took that one and brought it over here and then saying who got their pope close of probation and you'll just said it's the papacy so you take it back again and it's that and then you can do Revelation 18 verse 6 then you de put Revelation 18 verse 6 here wouldn't you probations close and now probation now is going to be punished yes so go back to revelation 17 and Rabelais revelation 17 10 and 11 verse 3 10 and 11 and there are seven kings five are fallen one is and the other is not yet come and when he cometh he must continue a short space so let's just go with that bit there are seven Kings five are fallen and one is where are we there do all know that do you know that my sister yeah okay I'm just making sure that she that's you're saying yes to my question look you're saying yes some people just say yes when I said get out of trouble so we're here when there's the one is end okay so we put Sunday little bits technically not something off I'm gonna suggest we'll put it Sunday law so one is and five are fallen back here yeah and then what does it say one is yet to come so he's that one this one are we here like that should I cook can I put seven and six and we will okay there so the base has got how many heads seven and then 11 and the Beast that was and is not even he is the eighth so verse 10 we've just done this we've said 7 Kings were right there are 7 Kings 5 were and 1 is so this is there is we okay with that number 6 is is but while number 6 is is what does it say about in verse 11 and we at the same place in verse 11 sister Terri in verse 11 their way the same place as you are in verse 10 so okay so where we and where are we in verse 10 which which way maka we are weighty 1798 so you okay with that one here yeah so when you come to verse 11 he now says in verse 11 and the Beast that was and is not so in the in the present context it says is you agree with that okay so that is the present isn't is not so we're still here then so you agree we're still here so we've just under repeating enlarge so if we're going to be repeating enlarge the six is is what it's a lie so the six is a life and while the six is a lie what does it say about the beast know in present tense those present tense you're going to them you go to the past who's not so what is the beast thing he is the age you know I'm not asking what he is but I'm saying in the past present or future what's the what takes are you in at the present read the phrase that says in the present tense now verse 11 it's not he's not saying okay this is not what it is not me he still did not still day not still day he's is dead he's dead okay yeah yep he's day so he's dead here if he's dead here what was he before I'm alive can you see at universe for his car cuz he was he was he was what a nice okay so this was so the Beast here is what alive he's a lie so the beasts is our life here and the business is dead here why is the Beast dead the wound hasn't been healed why isn't why isn't willing healing who comes in the problem this one this is cool this is this is not allowing this one to come alive so you have to get rid of this one and get to this one and when you get to this one then what happens Thank You Vera to the one that was just in the verse so we read the rest of the verse and the Beast that was in the dark ages and is not even he is the eighth so where's the eighth where do you place the eighth brother Johnathan after seven here yeah what did you point to these bad things getting destroyed now yeah yeah this is what I'm saying so if you run it sequentially normally you put it after seven but if it the eighth is one of the five before so he has the same fun but I decided oh one of the 7-yard here's the same function than those before so I asked sister olive a what's the key phrase that you picked up here and what was the key phrase it's on the board beast so you mean bursty lebanese talking about what's the worst verse eleven talking about no in 1711 and the beast is about the beast isn't it so he's talking about the image of the beast by the way is there is there an eight head so if he's got the six and then the seventh there is no eight so it eight doesn't really exist so what would the eighth be it would be a copy because he says he's of the seven so he's saying that eighth is a copy of the seven so where'd you see the word copy back here revelation 13:5 so you see a copy so yes 30 thank you 13 15 so it's a copy so what when it says the eighth here the eighth is what yeah if you look at the word image it means copy so the 8th is our what a copy of one of the seven I'm going to put an extra word in here what we don't want to put in no put to copy of one of the seven I'm going to add those two words yeah it's a copy of one of the seven because if you go through all of them if you go through these histories one two three four five six seven so you've got the seven heads so that that's fine and we're hearing this history aren't we one is says the Beast is dead so there's the Beast is dead and it says the Beast was alive so you have to ask yourself the question when the Beast was alive here when is the Beast in existence the eye is a copy of one of the seven one of the heads the no I said that's why I've underlined it I lead that in because if it just says one of the seven he didn't say what he said sorry he's a copy of the seven says he's of the severed you have to ask yourself the question which seven is Yad and what one can it be which one can't in which one can it not be cannot be the six because that wouldn't be much purposely you weren't copying something that's dead so it must be one of the five because you can't be the seventh can it because it's running concurrently so you the eighth is is a copy of one of those seven so the pod so you so if you're going to run seven here you'd put eight here like brother Jonathan said if you put eight here you have four you begin to have problems because there are not eight heads there's only seven that's that's the whole point that's why I put it here the eight is the seventh okay so the eighth is the seventh and we've got that but it says he's of the seven so which of the seven is it it can't be the current one that it is because it's all in existence you can't be the six so you've got a choice of one of these five so without spending ages going through the chapter it's this one that it's a copy of so if it's an image of the beast what do you have in this history you have the original based so we'll just put B for base so here's the original based and here's the image of the based threat original beast so to me the hard connection to put this one and this one and tie them together is that this history here is a copy of this history here they're identical copies this is the beast that was over here it was a life it is dead and it's going to come alive or when it comes alive again now it's called number eight and number eight is a copy of one of those ones that came before it and and it's chosen number 8 because 8 is a symbol of resurrection we I think we know that so to me that would be the hard connection between this one and this one you can do it through the Sunday law close of probation Sunday law close of probation we've got revelation 13:5 the labors and the works the word in the testimony you've got the 1260 and the persecution for the word and testimony in the same history here and you can do it through revelation 17 that when you see that this history here is the image or a copy to the Beast which is connecting to this one and one more passage revelation 20 verse 4 and I saw Thrones and they sat upon them and judgment was given unto them and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus and for the word of God so you've got the tooth there for the witness of Jesus what's the witness of Jesus the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God so we got the wordings testimony right here the same two things you got word and testimony and it gives you the context which had not worshipped the Beast neither His image neither had received his mark upon their foreheads or in their hands and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years so it's the it's the history of the image of the Beast and we've got revelation 20 verse 4 in eleven sixty 11 I think and 24 so he will run out of time I just wanted to okay so the question is just in closing those are the third angels message is it talking about those who died naturally or those who died as martyrs because the martyrdom begins here and Adventism today teaches that those who died under the third angels message are all of them and to me that would like indicate you need to stay in the boat if you want to be saved wouldn't it and we're teaching what get into the dinghy hit the back of the boat because the boats headed to a crash and so if this was correctly it's kind of like a peace and safety message you stay in the boat it'd all be okay till you get here because we're teaching by time you get here if you're still in that boat you're doomed to destruction yeah private area I think that I think I see your point but couldn't you say that it's outside of a struck outside of the structure and it's if you're going to talk about the 30th message whoever has the whoever actually has the third angels message you know there's a lot of Adventists who in theory didn't really have it you know just there's always wheat and tares and all the wheat would be revived or would be resurrected that's how I've understood it in the past all of these good Adventists all the way through but but I guess what I'm asked what what I would want to think is or understand his revelation 14 verse 13 when it says blessed are the Dead that die in the Lord from henceforth is that just normal death or is that martyrdom death for sure because 20 verse 4 he's definitely martyred them and so if you put them if you put the things together it seems to me that you'd be marking this those who died in the third angels message in this death which is the death of martyrdom not this the death of a regular Adventists not to say that there's not a blessing or they're bad people I'm not going to make any judgment upon them in that way but just to understand what are the special privileges of being in the third angels message just like it's not it's only the worst sinners that are gonna be here not any old sinners and it's those who specifically pierced Christ not anyone who pays to us because we've all pious Christ you know every time you sin you pierce him afresh and kill him it's a specific group of people who have done some special crime or something specially good and what's what's Advent is done that's particularly good you know all the way through this history nothing mostly really mr. white then she wouldn't for whatever reason I've always understood whether it's an ism or whatever that she would be in the special resurrection but I guess by this definition she wouldn't be there by this definition she wouldn't be there I mean I'm told if someone was in a video I think of what if they'd given a quote I'm going to back out of this whole thing you get the impression that it is first their familiarity persons are of some familiarity with the experience of the persons that are you want to learn 44,000 ways that verse where she talks about Mondays when they get off to see they I think it is in this thing okay so I've already but I'm maybe I've missed it you say when you resurrect here you look round you say oh I know you okay yeah if this is correct I'm hoping then it's not if this is correct I mean it day looks like it's correct I'm not trying to it's destroying Adventism yeah there's no comfort in being just an Adventist and thinking you know you you can add all these special privileges it strips all of that away from you and it's a great privilege to be part of this movement that now we have actually got the possibility to actually be in a special resurrection in a way that no one else has ever had the privilege before let's pray Heavenly Father we thank you for your goodness and mercy we want to ask and pray that you would continue to guide and bless us we thank you Lord for the great privilege of being called at the end of the world may each of us cherish the privilege well it's so easy to think that we're unworthy it's so easy to imply or suggest that you didn't have enough wisdom to choose your servants wisely Lord may we not look upon ourselves and see our unworthiness but rather may we trust in your wisdom in calling us and may we rise to the challenge Lord unflinchingly be with us bless us and guide us we ask complained uses his name I mean