(10-03-17) - King of the North - (8Dt3e4oYEzU)

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Publish Date: 10/4/2017
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Language: English
Channel Group: ASOTP
YouTube Title: (10-03-17) - King of the North-8Dt3e4oYEzU
YouTube ID: 8Dt3e4oYEzU

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let's pray amen revelation 13 verse 2 the Beast which I saw was like unto a leopard and his feet was at the feet of a bear and his mouth as the mouth of a lion the dragon gave him his power and his seat and great Authority have we agreed that the pronoun his in this verse is the dragon as opposed to the beast but we discussed it last week's tray so I said something thirteen verse two says the dragon gave him his power and his seat who is the his so we discussed this last week and I think we came as a class to a conclusion that it was the dragon I'm just checking it we're still in the same place Johnson yeah why's the his the dragon not the beast we see the transition from taking Rome - yes grandma I tried the gram of it initially but people objected to the grammar what this ecstatic molera should we say that how can the dragon give himself this wrong power in itself is all see so it says in the secondary sense okay so we know he's taking right the power is Wayne and we say that because it tell me take something close is military power okay like he saw some people smiling as one unit of sometimes a patient of thought and the seat 3:30 so he's a watt so he has a throaty 3:30 yeah we can pick up with the couple that in the second part of the other reason that we haven't looked at it when it takes his power he see what he said about the authority could be cited in gray there's nothing whose authority is it it doesn't say his authority so the distinction made between the authority and the power and the seat all right you say that you know so the question is why before you answer why or discuss why this one I think you do probably need to go into history to work out what as we said the power in the seat up I know it's military and rulership how do we describe that if we've got power seek and authority what do we think the authorities the authority of state power so I've got power seat and authority so if the authority state power what is a monarch have it's good against Mike if you said the authorities say Paola what would you describe the state as because he's is a king now who knows if this seat is the seat of the state part because if you're a king you're ruling over your okay so that's a sight Paola yeah I would see if that like all misunderstood I was often what the authority box o the authority cover some point was brought out about the authority the past that that it means that there's no major opposition as we know that the authorities came you know in history when the opposition to the papal supremacy was removed by right side over 538 because it was patrol 508 to 538 is when the Aryan kingdoms were removed and that's when the authority you know was in full swing I understand okay I'm just saying someone else is got any thoughts I've seen here when when you have authority people respond you have in command and people obey because like the police have authority okay so you saying Authority means what come on goodbye yeah I think you say yeah anyone else I'll rip your own way okay have your own way just uh a couple thousand here but represent his charter says uh he's made two supreme here the churches in 538 okay yep - absolutely this what it sort of look but it's what yes these three kings these three kingdoms were taken by Justinian Emperor Constantinople whose decree made the Bishop of Rome supreme head of the churches 538 you think that's what base that's a part of the authorities Oh 30 to change times and laws so you get to wait Daniel 7 so read that and he shall speak great words against the Most High shall wear and think to change times and months and I shall be given into his hand into the time and times and the dividing of time yeah the way that I understood this war was saw the power and the cedar state powers that since the papacy is an antichrist and he's trying to set himself you know about everything that is called God that he needs those things to take that place of God and the authority is his authority which is in his to compel the consciousness of men so so he's given this because he has the the seed and the power he gets his authority that's not really his to compels people's consciousness to worship Him as God that's Tyler he that makes a time I was consistently similar but I think the I guess test Nathan kind of already some of the summarize those things out but you have to see I think that his the the possessiveness of the his is really important because state power obviously you could in your mind at first glance you could say that state power and authority might be the same thing but the dragon had that power to be able to give you know God has always given the state power to earth the kingdoms and that has always been theirs except for in the time of Israel but they so if this if this authority it's not something that the dragon can give and we know that state power was something that he did indeed have and this has to be something else and I guess we're answering that now as the changing of times and laws of the compulsion of conscience which is something that no birthday monarch has that bites eight so we're saying is a distinction between these two and the last one yeah so the dragon has these he possesses them he hands them over to the Beast because they're his to give but the last one isn't his to give and what is what is it that he has to offer he has state power divided into state and charger power big ones want that one in that one but personally I thought I wish I wouldn't be able to say now which ones are aware but I'm saints stay power okay and then that was the last one to speak so easy for latest power or the latest authority and has a stake a legitimacy handing over religious authority to anybody he doesn't even possess it itself yeah so that's the argument that I had about who they the hisses the dragon owns these two things but it doesn't own religious authority has no right to hand over religious authority to anybody it doesn't possess it in the first place but nevertheless gives that to the papacy does that happen buddy else I have a question could it be said in understanding these verses that that the dragon gave him his power and his seat and a result and the result of him giving his power in this seat then the church ends up usurping great authority or you know taking on straight Authority but wonder what his but to overstep and take that so what is the would you set me to not that it's not yours and they figure you're just stealing something and I'm at something that is your yeah what else okay and step into a position that you weren't authorized to have in the first place - you usurping someone else's Authority okay so if I were to usurp something by usurped something from you have I taken that from you that you willingly gave to me okay so if we're going to use the word you serve yeah then we're suggesting that whatever this authority it was the dragon didn't willingly give to the base he took something in a way that was given to him like this we know it can't be by forces the church doesn't have that the strength to do that and then illegally would mean it would be against the law so did the papacy had this authority against the Lord in the arts of if you go back in history's no it was actually given to him it was offered to him okay so you serve doesn't apply along now okay I don't think the world you serve applies because you sleep involuntarily okay bye I can run this thing and gives it to him but he doesn't have any legal basis to do something so we want to see that there's state power and religious power and in this first now we took a long time to go through 13 - in certainties relatively straightforward versus in our message most people most time we've never go through that but I wanted to get used to the idea of actually reading verses and trying to understand what exciting and in my travels I noticed a lot that we don't have a habit of doing that I've actually trying to understand what the verses mean because if you don't you fall into the problem that you don't see the implications of what it's showing so one of the things that we've seen is if this is oh we didn't give a date for this oh yes we did we we 533 so we've got 533 he has religious authority let's go to this 3:30 date yep just Union was to improve this room yes still pagan yes that question or statement we were saying that the the great Authority is not here so it's not pagan Rome's Authority purchased in yen he was the emperor of East Rome it's still pay in Rome so the emperor of pagan Rome get the Pope great Authority yes second question or statement I think I don't get that you say that I understand that there is a distinction between authority and state power but doesn't this show the historical fact that it was pagans authority taking Rome's Authority I think he shows historical fact that was given to the papacy but I think it's showing the hell can you give something if you don't own it how can you give something if you don't know so he's he agrees with that who's asking how can you give something that you don't have because I understood the discussion that the great Authority was honest was not in in possession of the pagan Rome may be understood wrong but so yes so there's the dragon power have religious authority over people someone said about conscience I mentioned Roger so who gave faith who gave pagan Rome the religious authority to do things then we asked a different question who gave pagan Rome the state power to do things he set up Kings Fergus to have the Kings isn't it isn't it God that did that so at the level if God did that you know God God gave him all of this and he says now I own it legitimately in sight of heaven but God never gave them religious authority that was never that was never offered to to any of those kingdoms that that's how I understand what what this passage is teaching it's teaching that you know you can do what you want you can go and kill everybody illegally but you don't have any it's not in your authority or power or right you have it in powers of it your right to do that you don't have that kind of authority that's given from God to do certain things anyone else I think that in the wilderness of temptation that was brought up with Christ when you never told him to bow down and he said thou shalt worship the Lord thy God and him only shalt thou serve so it was showing that Satan had claimed to be the rule of the earth so therefore he would be that he is the dragon out there and he still in Christ to worship Him and Christ no points him to it's the true Authority saying you don't have that form to tell to compel me to bow down to you that authority belongs to God it's not enough you're not mad at me for someone else it's the papacy thanks to change times and laws because in this versus society it does change it does like that story attend a week they can do those things but in another level it only things to do it because what God ordains they can't actually change amen brother okay yeah okay so if you know you have kind of easygoing with that good you have to live with that now 3:30 ID let's just have a quick look at 3:30 ID what's he giving in 330 ad given this seat in the CTS 308 power a drug we've called it wrong yeah okay let me let me ask this question then Daniel 11 verse 40 Part A and Daniel 11 verse 40 Part B does everybody understand why I take Part A and Part B yeah so can we have some dates okay so this is straightforward yes 1798 in 1989 in this part of the verse here the paper says title is what part I what's the paper says title no it was odd trick question king of the north and in the second part of the verse its title is it's nice trick question then just now you're getting all cautious you think I'm doing some trickery king of the north okay what do we call this power here this papal power create paper rope or something yeah what did we call this one so give a different name why did we give it a different name for sorry my sister you said something say something change it what's changed what dispensations what we changed from and into because speak a bit louder because private conversations millerite history to our history with that work dispensational chambers party but it is that in 1798 the papal power lost this civil power there and then in Part B you see this really just ended here save it nada I mean I got the first part it lost its civil power in a heartbeat in 1989 receiver is this third to receive both a the papacy so you say to say night so I'm asking why we give it a different name because Toby momentum I'm just looking at five year he's saying that he loves this civil part in having a civil point 1719 you it being the papal papacy yes never been hateful Road yes okay James party somewhere else wondering if you is are a-changin I'm just saying in my mind this because he loves this civil forum 70-90 understand apart late I'm just giving up Krista I don't we talking about new UXA now for purview I'm asking so now we send the king of the north is that is the USA so who's the ships chariots and horsemen okay so then are you talking about then you need give it to him smarter no no ask the question we give it a new night and I'm asking why can we give it a new name okay so I went throughout modern right I'm gonna call it bad Rome or any right it's a new name whatever they would give it it's not the same name is that when I'm asking why is it a new name they want a good seat okay does that want to receive the seat every c6c way in 1989 we say wait okay so this this car polemic is changing I'm the one ask the questions and you have the brakes to answer you can ask me questions so you got your carts and stuff don't ask me questions because it's not going to work that way so Brittany what's the name of this entity here part a where would you call it this if you're standing with someone you what would you call that name that kinga's are not you king of the north is who the papacy so what would you call it in Part B what would you call the king of the north their papacy it's the same thing no difference I'm just that's what you're doing a study you say papacy the papacy same thing no difference Rome only has two phases which it's though the two phases is pagan and papal so papal Rome he's only a singular phase its papal Rome here and it's papal Rome here no he's that he's suggesting I thought your person was about earth sensations know why I asked was I've heard the great guy know the this king of north is two different names and asked what the name is and someone said modern romance what I heard so Martin what's the legitimacy we've given it a new name and you're saying don't do that it's the same name so when does it when do the guests name change Lee tomorrow yes so the next verse verse 41 so by time you get to verse 41 now it's changed its name okay okay I know I want to make it to incest I'm sorry I'm sorry brother Jonathan I would I think modern wrong it's not only the papacy it's a three-fold um it's the United Nations so let me stop you there now you're saying modern Rome is not just the papacy so is that one just the papacy no that's not just a paper see either then so then you've it I'm going to ask you that's not just the papacy they lose the ships and the chariots and the horseman know what is what I'm saying that this relating power in the Dark Ages was papacy just the papacy okay with it with its armies if you want to say it this way then either how you want to say a city I would say it's just a papacy with its armies but then you stop me there so this one is papal Rome and France if that's what you're identifying that king of the north to be so I would put paper road plus frogs that's what the definition of that is is that what you're saying they're not gonna wash you who the king of the south is no I would say the room just paper roll and if this one you're going to say it's not just paper right if if we stick to it to modern room I would say it's not only the paper see it would be 19 so the United Nations the United States that the combination of the purposes so he so he combines with himself because the ship then Charak supports me USA United States Army so how'd you how you going to structure that verse that you're not making them two separate entities that's right so you're not saying now but in the 1980s john paul ii getting it going to lie to run a reagan you say something different you're reinterpreting how about how we approach that verse yeah but it doesn't okay but I would say in verse 40 we see it's talking about the king of the north and actually the king of the north the United States when you say the king of the north is the papacy the United States is not the papacy but it talks about ships are horses and we know that's the United States but it's part of the king of the north it's part of the king I don't know because they because it's talking about the king of the north enters into the countries and somehow there must be a connection or somehow the United States must be attached to the king of the north okay they might be attached but other this looks I need the same thing nothing is a big difference between the two of them they're they're saying the same thing or they're attached I thought Lisa's foundational stuff I don't mean that as an insult and who does pen type is lightly sorry it was just slightly I need C's hang I think that yeah yesterday yesterday it was we do that thing on the board the depiction of Europe right there where we have Rome in the middle and that's a statement that Byzantine and what we identified was that you have the papacy in the middle in Rome but you have these armies of Rome on either side protecting it and doing the feeding the harm so to speak that can do things because the papacy can't do things and I think that's what we're seeing and we identified yesterday and that that threefold Union is whenever Rome is doing something it's always present and so Rome always needs to get help from someone to do its bidding and that's what we're seeing here in verse in verse 40 but apparently we're not seeing that because apparently we're saying he gets help from himself because he and the army are the same entity they both the king of the north but as you say yesterday we thought otherwise this is certainly a challenge and your question was why we would young named it modern Rome and I was just thinking each face of Rome when we say it's three faces had to conquer three obstacles so in 1989 it starts the progression to conquer the three obstacles to be then the new face of well okay so if you don't give it a new name you lose your ability to have a triple application don't you yeah and this is a triple application that you have to use I think you have to use it to actually understand endtime prophecy we've have to is the right maybe it'd be good to maybe you could work it out and if you can work in another way it's the it's the argument that we use so that's why we've been forced to give it a new name because there's no name that's called modern Rome it just this one we've invented in this movement no sorry there was a couple of hands up here somewhere but I lost track of whose hands had no one but she's not responding so at that point but it hasn't reached its complete fulfillment - to receive the fullness of that name until it conquers 4-3-3 okay yes we know it means progress its sister Brittany you said that its pursuit Li still the same name it's gonna be different in the next verse he stated that positional you want to shift what I was going to say that it would receive the new name and verse 42 awesome you said to Sunday look sorry okay so you're saying it doesn't even get there until here I'm serious the three entities were happy until the three entities of conquer okay so I don't know another price when did it hurt the two entities are conquered or the three you said we should win the three entities are conquered today is that you say when the three entities come together and make my row okay so when the two entities are conquered and they the three called Union comes yeah is that you say yeah when when when did or will that happen when did the free fall Union come together if you check google youtube or ever well it's accessible on there Wendy that is that future eBay the threefold Union coming together at the future in vain that's what the Church teaches Sunday Lord spiritualism Catholicism the prospect protein all going to come together we didn't teach that do we threefold unions already here isn't it when did it come in the exert into existence a hard date 911 why 1989 system Oh the the alliance that what liars with whom lose the church whose estate poker run Reagan someone yesterday said that if you think about the UN and you think about the United States there's just the same entity because they bankroll the UN pay fifty percent I think some of the fifty percent of all the finances so who said 9/11 why not I need eleven brother Tyler just a Bible verse songs for you okay so we were literally only pair Tom's faulty I do that I mean do that totally next we're gonna turn then we have to turn there but are you okay with that learning it starts all J's 911 it's anybody not okay with that right kids were assembled oh and then they ran away because of then the least weight they run away cuts of an east wind yeah but what is President Bush Senior say just around 1989 that kind of time it's New World Order he already told you the New World Order is here yeah even if you didn't like think about regular so yeah I'm not saying it's they make eighty nine for safer in that history he's already telling you it's here so I'm saying that the threefold Union is a part of the event so we're gonna use that logic sister Brittany I'd say that the new name would have been given in the past not in the future because they're already here in the whole city okay if you're gonna tell you that it is manifested then you say what is well what's the point of we've made a distinction between I from my remembrance I thought we were saying that the threefold Union is when they all come together but I guess piercing they already have I guess moving the white marks no so what took place on 21 and 42 then what is going to the future if they're already they're beginning they're going to begin to do what they've been unable to do so just with Psalms 48 they would have already done they would have very orderly exercised their ability their strength their power their agenda they would have exercised but they were prevented from doing that why would they prevent it from doing that because of our foolishness yeah it's our foolishness that's prevented them doing what they wanted to do got in these mercy has protected us because we weren't ready so we've got a little bit more time before they're going to be allowed to do what they want to do so they've been restrained even though they're already ready to pounce they've been restrained until the four winds are loosed when they're loosed then they'll be able to put into effect what they've been desperate to do they're not going to suddenly all form together and get things going they're already ready that's how I've understood what the threefold union is is already they're already together but they're unable to do what they want because of God's restraining power but the bomb Jason by the time if you look at sacred history even though there might have been some other backroom conversations between the United States and the papacy long before this it came out in the open the whole world was on the cover of Time magazine where it shows a picture of John Paul shaking hands with Ronald Reagan right there the date that they had already formed a union right there and it was in 1989 that that came out I think once did the chief they go does that make sense whatever you need to make think about a bit more from Jason yeah I mean did that make the logic that hopefully said it hopefully it's what we've already talked in the past or not changing things I think what I make a statement on be so fun the truthful Union will come in together I am saying that they are coming together no and there's a coalition in testimony volume 9 page 11 paragraph 2 that's going to read a little portion which says that the agency of evil are combining your forces and consolidating they are strengthened for the great crisis which changes are soon to take place in order on the final movement with the rapid one so I'm saying that they are coming together gonna come together it's on dollas Adventism teach you know that this is coming to get up no we are consolidating what's the crisis crisis this is Sunderland to my understand yeah that's how I understand it it says they to what agency the people are consolidating yeah they're already doing their brother Tyler hey I think the answer to my question is progressiveness but I just want to raise that I guess there's the quotation and they're just looking for and I can't remember all the words but it says something to the effect of wind Protestantism stretches his hand the cross and the cross behind of spiritualism and papal ISM exactly how it was wonderful okay she says when that takes place then we shall know the marks it's time for the marvelous workings of Saint Indian and the threefold Union is established and we've always we've always taught that that the hands grasping was that the Sunday law but I think like I said I think the answer to my question is progressiveness there's always groundwork that's laid before him that leads you to a particular point we think wait wait we were the Church of this movement movement okay yeah so I hope taking it no not I don't know I don't I've always understood the that one quotation maybe I can find it and we connect five T four five one of these three four that that quotation says when under the influence of these three four Union our nation shall serve food he ate the principles and she goes not to talk about the Sun Allah what this point in then that the threefold Union would have done would have to be formed previously because she says when under the influence and she talks about first I think in which is talking about the image of the beast will be formed when they meet with contestant fallen participants stretch their hands across the goal of fun cross the abyss and cross country papacy and sprinkle it will react ated botany shall move on in it's absolutely a week I mean we definitely know that's nine eleven don't we yes how do we understand the phrase or the word assembled that's four before you understand the word assembled who are the kings there be spoken of they follow the Kings were assembled everything case took the kings of the earth kings of the earth will pick out define them I think of a Tim Kaine revelation 17 represent all nations revelation 17 you say yes far as the revelation 17 what birth and then you say Daniel Daniel what chapter and what verse so rather rich you saying that these Kings are the kings of revelation 17 there any agreement or disagreement on that yeah 17 verse versus them eat you see right you think this twenty-something could say verse eight year versed world and the ten horns which thou sawest with ten Kings which have received no Kingdom as yet but receive power as kings one hour with the Beast yes is that the same Kings and he says that they were assembled and it also says they were together Psalms 48 verse 4 so if they're assembled in there together they must have one mind less than they they all got one purpose to seek and destroy Jerusalem so then is that the definition of I I understand of the assembly is the fact that there's now this one union and the one union by definition even though you're going to struggle in verse 12 because it says the one hour has to have a union connected with with the Beast in verse 12 17 12 for them to come together they must be with the beasts the base that brings them together yep yes nevermind okay so we're forced to make it a new name okay how did that new entity we could go I don't know why maybe we think about we could have gone to revelation 17 verse 8 because we've already discussed 17 verse 8 why would we go to 17 verse 8 well could we maybe maybe I'm wrong because it's coming out of a bottomless pit he's coming out of a bottomless pit must be new manifestation of the same power yeah so if it's because it's a resurrection isn't it it's a resurrection of the same thing so technically it would be the same but because he comes out of the bottomless pit it's a new manifestation it's a different power it's not the same one so it's not the same one we had the legitimacy to give it a new name yep the early good so the owners I want to mention all of that is to make us so that we're sure that there's two separate entities this one and this one are not the same beasts different animal yes so we've got how many Rome's three Rome's do we have agreement on that yeah okay so it says in the second part of the verse the king of the north is going to retaliate against the king of the south and that verse 40 Part B begins what the overthrow of three entities because that's what I think sister Brittany said that this is the threefold three the three powers it has to bring down before it can rule supremely no this is number three number two number one was pagan Rome yeah yeah so we're calling it papal of more modern Rome or modern papal Rome whatever phrase we give it because I church doesn't make the distinction yeah our church doesn't make the distinction should they yeah because if you don't you get into problems seeing what's happening today because what's happening today in the world oh yeah you've got the third wow that's we need to contend with Revelation night and if you don't see modern Rome there's a separate entity you don't have any way to place the third one so what you for what would you force to do then win the third way what do you have to make it you can't see this distinction okay that's where but what what would you make what would you be forced to make the third one and attack on Christmas by whom by Aslan no no I don't think that is love you would change yeah what would it be change to what would you be forced to change because this is the logic that the Pioneers you James White particularly your same way must be a whopping maybe do persecution unless on your life I'm not sure persecution under Sunday law okay James why is going to tell you that the third well is the plagues isn't it you'd be forced to put if you don't see this this thinking between the roams the punishments going to happen at the end of the world it's the seven plagues and I think I think we teach that in the church you're taught to do that we're saying it's becoming my Davone is that 1798 or Vitamix or the two dates are you I've got the question what are the two dates you just go 1798 which are part of 1114 are you saying it's becomes modern Rome well is it why don't we both know this is papal Road and this is modern Road okay so from 1989 because my demo okay so that's my next question if we agreed that's the first one is to agree that on that way so 1989 the first horn what happened to the first one it's a feeling for okay first is that correct why was it born okay power then because the horn is a power because it's a Brittany said these threefold three people get take it on your shoes the word horse because she didn't say I it is what happens in 1989 which ones you talk about like I taught the lamb like this hour doesn't my brain were in the South a theism is the first obstacle taken down in 1989 no it's October now and you're ten months is the first opportunity get down in 1989 no no it's not is it to the movie that's what we take you for two decades plus yeah and we've realized that that's not quite correct yeah yeah because we're sitting verse 30 the work is not being accomplished yeah when's it gonna be accomplished by that's right no crew did not cry someone say Sunday law so verse 40 would be Sunday law will be verse 41 then I've lit what what were you saying the work of bringing sorting that sorting the King of the South out straight so - yeah so I'm asking when he's first funky going to be completely fine midnight cry it sounds reason behind that logic yeah ok so the first doesn't mean that then you've got the second and the third what happens by the time you get to verse 42 I where I mean verse 42 where here yes 538 so we're in five Sunday law for verse 40 verse 32 either son-in-law is Nick yes okay no it's not more than 31 by verse 4 verse 42 we're here kind of yeah yes yeah yeah when we do verse 41 verses 42 it's a bit of a problem because he actually here in verse 42 or somewhere else verse 42 is a bit of a unless you could I don't think you can put it on that line that easily Universal Sunday Laura okay risk for you to be the universal Sunday though right yeah so so if we were forced to put it somewhere we'd have to put it here okay so no you don't see it all complete by then so here verse 31 she was 7 verse 41 it's 538 we're okay with that yeah so if verse 32 is here so we're saying all of the through all of the two people or so all of the three entities are all been taken down by that stage by the end here yeah in reality does it actually work that way where we before Egypt being taken down the world been taken down uh-huh Tyler if I can't prove it at some point were born but halfway or it depends on what kind of like you're looking at I guess because it's definitely how complete there if you want to talk about the progressiveness of conquering the world but it begins at least it to Sunday long you know it's definitely there but sad K with the people hey what does it say here no no that's not thinking oh is that the Kings are ruling with it it so we couldn't repot verse 42 pic and we see this they're not ruling anything that about to be destroyed the raw deal incentives yeah so you put verse 22 at the back end philosophically it's wrong you're gonna draw a simple simplistic line you know it works and the reason you do that is because we're Z where you can place the universal Sunday law it's a bit later for it there isn't it because if it's universal what are the kings doing could you say not all the kings of doing it because it's not Universal yeah no Tyler I've always read the the Universal Sunday laws that it's not and I could be wrong it's not an actual decree but it's the fact that everyone has completed done this work you know that if each person here represents a country we've all made our Sunday lawn it's now Universal yeah yeah I'm really not trying to change away my commute I'm making sure that when we say Universal what what point will be making so that's there's that thing but the question was none of those ones my question is if this is modern Rome when deed modern Rome become the king of the north was it here or here or here well dear I'll put I'll put dates on these frequent well you paid something basic another one 1989 Sunday law and I put Co P because that's how we normally do it that's why I asked that question yeah 1989 and we I carried out three it begins the work it's not complete I agree with that so where is he the king of the north so 1989 I say if it's 1989 I'm going to read the verse it says this person in 1989 began to take down the king of the south and that made him the king of the north where I'm not sure how you just raise it my brain takes a second okay in verse four you still do it's continuing the war of that can your north in the king of a cell okay so I'm going to take you back the ten minutes ago you said they're two separate entities now you might be now you're going to make you sequential injuries continuation it's still wrong wrong never changes right ah let's see you box yourself into a corner round it change your greed road change Drive never changes no no never changes then what's the third Road where you going to place that you lose your ability to place the third whoa if we if we if we lose if we lose the triple application that road comes three times that it's a new Rome brand new Rome then you get stuck we're gonna have a message does everybody see the significance or they lot the series of understanding these things that way yeah so coming back to my question when did this power here I'll call it mr modern Rome this was papal Rome when does modern Rome become the king of the north if I say to you John went and beat someone up when did John become John when he beat the person up sorry yeah so my question is when this modern Rome become the king of the north sorry so it must be before 1989 we okay with that sister Brittany you're not okay no I never said he began in 1989 people think he began in 1889 over 40 years they just bring you to a date that's that's my school so that's that's the at the back of my question that when did it become more in Rome Bravo Jonathan okay I know and either they actually beat me for if a lot people in you but we do we dig tackle all of this so when I came last time mostly about 18 months ago in the Class C so if they still up you could go and review them because we discussed some a lot of issues they bit of a refresher so it doesn't really work with it's all brand new people or they you in the past we did yeah but they Daniel ah I think I do minute Daniel mm so what makes the king of the north - the king of the north so what's the definition of being the king of the north you have to be a king so you have to be a king then we've got that you have to be a king okay so my question so you have to do what conquer three and then you become the king of the north just a big boy cuz he's away - the king of north eNOS started his work yet yeah we had to be ruling in the north okay so first of all you have to be a king and then you have to roll from where you have draw from the north yeah okay Babylon isn't even in the North you know that don't we that's in the east but we're going the north so you have to be king in the north western europe okay okay so in this cot in this context okay next try and address but let's not go with this one cuz we're not sure about let's go to history like we supposed to let's go to this one Wendy papal Rome become the king of the north that's how think 3/3 okay Oh about with with the papal we're all become the king of the north when they received their seated on the throne that makes them a king and winds up three thirty so you're making it here come the king of the north here we agree with that King Adelphia nut track I guess well off against it's the the line of conquering at one point whoever conquers the area that's wrong that's north of Jerusalem and sound the title the king of the north and eventually yes it takes control of the line of succession so when when does he begin to take control of the line of succession that's the question so you're saying he becomes the king of the north here in 538 yeah well he's not a power so by 538 if that's a Sunday law we're here so you've got structural problem because he's only King the north before even does this they're putting the cart before the horse but it still showing you that that can't be correct once they've been clocked up then you're saying is becoming the king of north here Daniel 12:1 because that's why so that's when the three horns of plot car so okay so my second question is do all three rows have to operate in the same way sister Brittany because if you don't do that you don't know you don't have any methodology because that's the argument you're going to use takes down three powers takes down three powers takes down three powers so once you start doing that then you're forced to run through that logic and you can't just change it any way you want to in its operations you never changes yeah of course yes we know the road never changes yeah no one ever changes do they got Jerusalem never changes it's always in a rebellion is that never changes no one ever changes we all with the same people so are we not okay we 330 Brad Nathan what's the seat and what does he know you say sorry not all that history but a seat is a throne isn't it and the dragon power gave him me seat would you agree that negating 330 so if it gave you me see he must be a king wasn't he I mean it's wrong but yeah let me ask you another question generally who makes a Sunday lawyer 3:21 not the name of the person the power okay which Rome yeah pagan Rome makes the Sunday law and he makes it in which country that's right no Rome here yes who makes the Sunday law here so once you make that Sunday law what's about to happen to you that's a rule you're gonna be punished yeah by the fourth Trump not by Islam no by the four trumpet powers yeah so where they going to send their weaponry they're gonna send it to Turkey what do you mean would it worry us anywhere for those four empires who are they going to come and attack so they're gonna come and attack Rome aren't they yeah they're not going to come and attack Constantinople no we're gonna be back just conceptually I mean to be greed that they're gonna if you make them if you make the law here and they're gonna attack you here because that's where you are yeah so who is a person that made the law Constantine so why isn't constantly the one that's going to get punished why doesn't constantine get punished when he's the one who made the law I lost a different question does Constantine get punished for making a Sunday law this kingdom get ripped apart so he comes over here is his part of the kingdom getting ripped apart them here in the East doesn't get ripped apart it's only in the West in fact you should go check the history when the Huns came where where were they headed east the West they were headed for the east been through some strange phenomena they shipped directly to the west there's some marriage and things like that you know some real life history but they shift from the east of the West all the full powers are going to come and destroy Western Europe why this destroy Western Europe when Western Europe was innocent they didn't do anything it was constantly the Emperor that makes the law why they're not attacking him what's his title by the way king of the king of the north with constantine king of the north it's pagan wrong the king of the north yes we agree pagan rome the king of the north say Pegram's kings north constantine must be the king of the north yes who made a Sunday law here 321 king of the north denis king of north made the Sunday Lord so when the king of the north makes the Sunday law who should be getting punished king of the north but when he makes a Sunday law in 321 what does he do he Musk location offer to any moose location it takes all of these household patty up a moose to Turkey when the punishment comes we should it be headed where should we be directed at should be directed at Turkey but it's not my question is why is it not why is the punishment not headed and focus upon Turkey when the man who caused the problem is muthi right because it's now look at them because there's no gas no we don't need to we've got all the information we don't need to get where they come it's like I think we talked about this yesterday is that the person who does the Sunday law never gets punished till the end they always it's always their armies or someone else that's receiving that for them and then just it seems like the same thing here with Western Rome sort of takes the hit for Constantine okay I'm about to say something I always get in trouble over there days because they say some people say I no longer use the Bible spirit fairy tale stories to make applications don't in the back to do that you own a Goldilocks so what's the story there she comes into what kind of a house occupied or vacant isn't it okay so who's Goldilocks in our story the papacy it comes in two we're in the vacant home when going the oxidative bacon home what's there the food everything's there isn't it they just left and left everything there so when Constantine leaves from Rome to go to Turkey what's he left he doesn't take everything with him no okay yeah but you repeat that for non-native English speaking people please okay so they wouldn't forget the parable cuz if you don't get it doesn't make a difference so I'll go without the parable now pagan Rome this here when he moves constitute Constantinople he leaves something what does he leave dress nice city he leaves his seat there's a neat because he's good what does that mean he gave me see he left his seat there so when he went to Constantinople he didn't have the same seat at the different seat do we agree with that you mean literally a suit however way you want to take it literally or not so the secret place okay not literally this is it yeah it makes really easily to say what is this what is the sake literally it's the throne is neck so he left the throne in Rome so indeed would have taken and within them be taking it with him then they went across they would have acted got the contact you know cool because that's where the king of the north is so he leaves he's thrown there what's attached to a throne okay it's a crown isn't it that's a definition of a throne and the crown is a symbol of your kingship or your title isn't it because you wear a fair mitre across your forehead I've it says Mystery Babylon or it is holiness unto the Lord one of the two your crown is that is a symbol that identifies who you are so on that crown what does it say what's what's written on that crown okay a king of the north isn't it yeah so he left his crown which is attached to his throne back in Rome when he lay because he knew he's about to be punished so he's gonna abscond from leave run away run away he makes a problem he runs away from the problem can we conceptualize that so that's why in 330 ad you begin the work of the four trumpets and it's going to come in this part of Rome Western Road because that's the part of Rome that calls the problem wasn't Eastern Rome the cause of problem because Constantine has left his seat which is his title way back here didn't you just say that Western Mariah's innocent yes they were innocent but someone's going to come and sit here and it's gonna be the Pope I was gonna come and sit in that in Rome he doesn't sound like that's nice bowl of porridge that's a nice seat I'll sit down here I'll take it because it's just been offered to him on a plate see he was he's often he takes he puts that crown on and he becomes the king of the north and then when these powers are coming they're saying where's his kingdom law because all this problems it's in Rome so that's why we the target in there is in this part of the kingdom that's why Eastern Rome is innocent it never gets hurt doesn't get fragmented so Eastern Rome is innocent not Western world yeah okay so then we the question was asked it was Western Rome innocent in the sense of the the people in the sense of the Western Roman sense of the Pope was the Pope Innocent did he do anything wrong the Pope do anything wrong what when you release tree it was because of their function that the influence constant and I don't mean in that sense I mean in this kind of story he can do anything wrong he just came to an empty seat and he sat down innocently he didn't realize what he was getting into he just does his own thing so as soon as he puts that title on that's why these people are going to start begin to get punished because pagan road there's moves location and when they moved they didn't take all their titles with them because they knew they were going to be in trouble so they left everything there all the evidence he's got left in Rome so when they came to attack they came to attack Rome so that's why the king of the north is in 330 ad for is not able to exercise himself until here so you see the progressive nature 200 years is sitting on the Strand it takes 200 years to actually wield power things happen faster at the end of the world so my question is now my point is 330s before the three horns of plucked upper isn't it long before when the first one plucked up normally we give a date when's the last one done 538 the first one five 38 40 watt 45 four 493 everyone agree with that yeah that's the correct answer just remember 45 you'll get the right answer even if you can't remember the date because everybody knows 538 just take 45 from it it's not coincidence is it okay so we know that he's the king look before he plucks up three horns we agree with that so we come back to our history we're not going to finish is that a because I only want to introduce this concept to you because there's a discussion in our movement about King not in the king of self at the end of the world is it Russia is it not Russia and we can have all of this intricacy and intrigue about it's in the United States this clean North King the South issue so before you even begin to tackle any of that you need to know about when the king of Nohr thinking in the south actually take their roles at the end of the world and one of the misconceptions that we have in our movement I think is that the papacy modern Rome modern Rome is already the king of the north before 1989 so we need to become king of the north modern Rome is already the king of the north before 1989 it's a misconception that yeah because that most people think it becomes the king in the north either here at the third or here in 1989 when it begins to do its work it begins to do its work he becomes the king of the north and historically you know that's not correct grammatically you know it's not correct maybe I said it wrong the misconception to believe that the purpose of become king of the north before 1980 not that they don't believe it don't see I'll rephrase it the misconception is that we think the king of the north the title is given we're in this history here not before but grammatically its before prophetically if you take three Rome's it would be full here so if you go back to pagan Rome when was pagan Roman law okay when is pagan Roman begin to rule supremely 31 BC Bible verse for that not sister on living someone else which book begin to go to Dan you need out there too okay to hang 1122 verse 24 she'll

off these devices against the

strongholds even for a time yeah time is 360 years take you from 31 BC to 330 ad yeah you have to flick around with that year 0 stuff and you get to 360 so we know that but when if you go to an evangelistic campaign where do you really put where do where does the church mark the transition from Greece to pagan Rome now not on the chart the church all the ones I've ever seen no man's opinion so what's the question you say I can't hear 168 so yeah that's what I've seen over no greats 168 why 168 yeah battle of pitner where safety Macedonia is going to be subjugated it's the beginning of the crushing of Greece yeah 168 then you go to the league with the Jews 161 158 then you eventually get to Cleopatra 31 Battle of Actium and just hold history in between there when it begins to roar supremely because pride by 31 BC it's taken out three territories yeah which verse is that pagan rotations three territories where do we see that which book Daniel chapter then you chapter 8 verse someone say verse 9 Daniel 8 verse 9 so eat the south in the pleasant line three territories that it takes down yeah so real familiar with that the dates got 31 BC the other two sixty four sixty three you've got no it's not 30 BC the last one the southeast 31 BC the back the back to you the other two before that so some people say 65 64 65 64 63 a comp a general Pompey he goes to subjugate the eastern part of the Roman Empire because they're causing trouble goes to Syria and then he goes the glorious land yes they say 64 is 65 I think he's 64 but I open to all four the southeast 3101 for the east it's 64 65 and I think it's the Jerusalem it's 63 but I think it's 64 gigas 6463 but I'm open to correction on that so if we were to go with that pagan Rome would be the king of the north before it takes down the three territories before it takes down Syria so you'd have to put a marker where that happens wouldn't you I'd know where you'd want to put that I would place it 168 begin to take down Macedonian Empire and that would be marking when it becomes the king of the north so if that was the case you begin to see here 33 30 papacy begins to become the king of the north so you'd have to go back here in the modern Rome and work out where that would be so all those people who are arguing about the king of north and the king of south at the end of the world making all these applications first thing I think you need to be considering is where do you even understand the king of the north to be created or to come into existence at the end of the world before you can start talking about anything and the other thing that we've brought up in class is from 31 BC King of the South he's taken down is it is that great the war between the kingdoms and the King of the South is you go through history Greece wasted where's the last place we see the King of the South what they what event were history in all of history Greece or just Greece wasn't when uh it's it's big above when I give one of the guys got chased down into Egypt good morning you chased okay see if you're gonna to let mark out and you're gonna talk about Egypt now you can do end up going to 31 BC yeah proper time its first thirteen fourteen fifteen okay so you can end up getting to the back of the pan iam in the infantry how you can that look that's when that's at least in the time of Greece okay so when rogue comes in and it starts to take control of the situation it's going to do that in three steps so ways that what's happened to the King of the South in that history is it still there or is it not there when it comes in at first appear grease is divided into how many parts let's say three Daniel 8 verse 9 yeah Daniel 8 verse 30 stated so Rome how to take down all of those three and this one is the king of the north Syria the glorious land which you might call cold Syria old Syria then the bit that's in between no-man's land and here's the king of the south so this is king of north no man's land in between and king of the south we okay with that and the verses that you said verses 1415 a 16 bit is basically gonna take you to the back of Panem which is the last place that you see it then Rome is going to be introduced and when Rome comes onto the scene what's even the tackle first okay but so so first of all you can take that Macedonia right the very beginning 168 then it's going to take down which is not part of this piece what is your weight in Syria it takes this one then it takes this one then it's going to take down Egypt but Egypt we've already identified is the king of the south isn't it so the king of the south gets taken in 31 BC sorry he's that question a statement okay yeah so the king of the south why happens to him afterwards so he doesn't exist so he doesn't exist when does he come back so he comes back all the way here in what they will be put for the revolution 1789 so here the king of the south is going to come back when he comes back now what is it new manifestation of satanic powers has the same power and now he's come back so when he comes back they're gonna resume the fight this fight between the king and Alton king of the south did it begin with Greece it's been going on a long time before that isn't it you've got the Assyrians and the Egyptians you've got the Babylonians and the Egyptians this war has always been going on you've got the meat of Persians and the Egyptians because this struggle is always existed between King and all thinking yourself so in this period here they've just been annihilated but they come back here into history yeah and then do they remain wipes is the king of the south here after 1798 did he go or does it stay it may move it as it stay yes not in cross as a symbol this person died like it doesn't exist here so it's gonna go all this here and then we're going to get to where 1989 so at least we've got the king of the south here in this history now now it's going to go from France to Russia so all I'm suggesting is that if you're going to start dealing with this issue in verses 5 to 16 there abouts rather late Daniel 11 and start talking about the Kindle talking in the south you at least have to make a correct application of history and track the King of the South in what it's doing before you start saying that making the King of the South Russia is an incorrect understanding of these verses I don't know if that makes any sense to people here but people have asked some questions on this issue so I'm saying it's not an answer to that question per se but it's how you think I think you should be approaching the problem to actually track these Kings and see where that what they're doing and when they come into existence so we haven't tackled or we haven't even seen when the king of the north the papacy so when that modern Rome becomes the king of the north because it's not 1989 so somewhere between 1798 and 1989 the king of the north has to have come into existence let's pray Heavenly Father we thank you for your goodness and your watch care we ask and pray that you would be with us and bless us well there are so many things that we take for granted so many preconceived ideas that we may or may not hold on to we ask for wisdom and understanding is we try to carefully studied these words we pray that you would guide us through your Holy Spirit we know that man's wisdom is useless when it comes to an understanding of your word therefore we beseech you Lord that you would guide and direct us in these studies in Jesus's name we pray amen